Name: 澤倫斯基：期盼烏克蘭、俄羅斯、美國首次會談「邁向終戰」！| BBC News (Zelensky hopes first Ukraine, Russia and US talks are 'step towards ending war' | BBC News)
Uploaded: 2026-01-23T17:41:52.000Z
Duration: 9 min

We start with peace talks and the war in Ukraine.

我們從和平談判和烏克蘭戰爭開始。

Top negotiators from Russia, Ukraine and the US Are heading to Abu Dhabi today.

俄羅斯、烏克蘭和美國的頂級談判代表今天將前往阿布達比。

It's the first time all three will have met since Moscow's full scale invasion of Ukraine nearly four years ago.

這是自莫斯科全面入侵烏克蘭近四年前，三方首次會面。

In the past hour, President Zelensky confirmed that territory will be discussed as part of those talks.

在過去一小時，澤倫斯基總統證實，領土將會是這些談判的一部分。

在此之前，普丁總統和川普先生的使者在莫斯科舉行了會談，克里姆林宮稱之為有用但非常坦率。

Trump's envoys held talks in Moscow, which the Kremlin called useful but very frank.

川普先生週四在達沃斯會見了烏克蘭總統澤倫斯基，他表示協議已相當接近。

Mr. Trump, who on Thursday met Ukraine's President Zelensky in Davos, has said a deal is reasonably close.

我們的俄羅斯編輯 Steve Rosenberg 將為我們報導更多關於前往克里姆林宮的美國使者。

Our Russia editor, Steve Rosenberg has more speeding to the Kremlin, the US Envoys.

俄羅斯編輯 Steve Rosenberg 將為我們報導更多關於前往克里姆林宮的美國使者。

You can see why Vladimir Putin appreciates Donald Trump.

你就知道為什麼弗拉基米爾·普丁會欣賞唐納·川普了。

He sends his emissaries here to discuss Ukraine and show respect for Russia.

他派遣他的使者來這裡討論烏克蘭，並向俄羅斯表達敬意。

And President Putin has just been invited onto Donald Trump's new Board of Peace for settling global conflict, even though he is waging a war.

普丁總統剛剛受邀加入唐納·川普新的和平委員會，來解決全球衝突，儘管他正在發動戰爭。

Then there's Greenland, where Donald Trump's quest to take control has allowed Russia to argue that it has the right to do what it wants.

還有格陵蘭，唐納·川普想要掌控的舉動，讓俄羅斯得以主張他們有權為所欲為。

In Ukraine, you see, one country can take anything if believes that it is in their favor of their security.

在烏克蘭，你看，一個國家如果認為符合自身安全利益，就可以奪取任何東西。

Why wouldn't we do the same if we believe that it is in favor of our security?

如果我們認為符合自身安全利益，為什麼我們不能做同樣的事呢？

我們不希望烏克蘭成為北約的一部分。

That's why we make what we do in our favor.

這就是為什麼我們做對我們有利的事情。

And there is another advantage the Kremlin will have identified from the whole Greenland saga, and

克里姆林宮從整個格陵蘭事件中，還發現了另一個優勢，

that is the tension it has sparked between America and her traditional allies in Europe.

那就是這件事在美國和她在歐洲的傳統盟友之間引發的緊張關係。

It's been sowing division in the Western alliance, and that suits Moscow just fine.

這讓西方聯盟出現了分裂，這正合莫斯科的意。

So you might think that Donald Trump would be rather popular right now with Russians, not especially on the streets of Moscow.

所以你可能會認為唐納·川普現在在俄羅斯人之間很受歡迎，但街上的莫斯科居民並非如此。

Most of the people we spoke to were suspicious of America's president and ready to give him the cold shoulder.

我們採訪的大多數人都對美國總統抱持懷疑態度，並準備對他敬而遠之。

He does one thing one day, the opposite thing the next.

他今天做一件事，明天就做相反的事。

Svetlana says watching Trump is like being at the circus or the theater.

Svetlana 說看川普就像在馬戲團或劇院一樣。

Oleg says the kind of things he's doing, the same could be done to us.

Oleg 說他做的那些事，我們也可能遭遇同樣的待遇。

Juliana tells me to begin with, I thought he was.

Juliana 告訴我，一開始我以為他是。

But Trump's aggressive approach to Venezuela, that was incomprehensible.

但川普對委內瑞拉的強硬態度，實在令人費解。

But the Kremlin isn't criticizing the US President.

不過克里姆林宮並沒有批評美國總統。

Moscow is enjoying the cracks that have appeared in transatlantic relations due to the course Donald Trump has chosen.

莫斯科正享受著唐納·川普所選擇的路線，在跨大西洋關係中出現的裂痕。

Any fracturing of the Western alliance is seen here as making Russia stronger.

在這裡，西方聯盟的任何分裂都被視為讓俄羅斯更強大。

BBC 新聞記者 Steve Rosenberg，莫斯科報導。

Well, let's go live to Kyiv now and speak to our correspondent there, Sarah Rainsford.

好的，現在我們連線到基輔，和我們的特派記者 Sarah Rainsford 聊聊。

So, Sarah, the first trilateral talks between these countries, what's expected this time around?

那麼 Sarah，這幾個國家首次舉行的三方會談，這次預期會有什麼結果？

Yeah, the first trilateral talks, although we don't know whether all three sides will be around exactly the same table at the same time, there's a lot that's still, still in doubt.

是的，首次的三方會談，雖然我們不知道三方是否會同時坐在同一張桌子上，但仍有許多事情懸而未決。

But certainly I think Ukraine is seeing this as a tiny step forward.

但我認為烏克蘭肯定認為這是一小步的進展。

Kiev has certainly engaged in Donald Trump's efforts to bring peace here to this country because Ukraine wants peace more than anyone else.

基輔確實參與了唐納·川普為這個國家帶來和平的努力，因為烏克蘭比任何人都更想要和平。

But it is pretty skeptical that Vladimir Putin is as committed to ending his full scale invasion of this country.

但他們相當懷疑弗拉基米爾·普丁是否同樣致力於結束他對這個國家的全面入侵。

So I don't think there's huge expectations from this meeting.

所以我認為這次會議的期望不會太高。

I think what Ukraine hopes will be discussed is the issue of security guarantees for this country, something a deal it believes it's already hammered out with the United States, which is all about what to do if Russia invades again in the future, what the United States will do in terms of military support for Ukraine.

我認為烏克蘭希望討論的是這個國家的安全保障問題，這是他們認為已經和美國敲定的協議，內容是關於如果俄羅斯將來再次入侵，美國將提供什麼樣的軍事支援給烏克蘭。

So with Washington and Kyiv believing there's some kind of deal on that, what will Russia actually say when it's presented with that deal?

所以，華盛頓和基輔都認為在這方面已經有某種協議了，當這個協議擺在俄羅斯面前時，俄羅斯實際上會說些什麼呢？

這是一個很大的懸而未決的問題。

And then of course, there is the massive issue of, of territory.

然後當然，還有一個巨大的問題，就是領土。

Russia is still insisting that it wants to take from Ukraine parts of the eastern Donbas region that it has failed to take through fighting on the battlefield.

俄羅斯仍然堅持要從烏克蘭手中奪取東部頓巴斯地區，而他們在戰場上未能成功。

他們希望烏克蘭交出那部分領土。

It's paid a massively high price for holding on to that territory.

他們為了守住這塊領土付出了極其高昂的代價。

And there's no way that Ukraine intends to hand it over now.

而且烏克蘭絕對不會打算現在就交出去。

So huge sticking points, a lot of tension.

所以，這就成了巨大的癥結，充滿了緊張氣氛。

But I suppose at least if you're looking to the positive, there is a progress, a process of talks is taking place and it will move to a further stage today in the uae.

不過我想，至少從正面來看，還是有進展的，談判正在進行，而且今天會在阿聯酋進入下一階段。

That's our correspondent Sarah Rainsford in Kyiv there.

這就是我們在基輔的記者 Sarah Rainsford。

Well, let's now bring in Stephen Blockmans, senior fellow at the center for European Policy Studies.

好的，現在讓我們連線歐洲政策研究中心的高級研究員 Stephen Blockmans。

As we heard there from Sarah, the talks are going to focus on security guarantees and territorial issues.

正如我們剛才從 Sarah 那裡聽到的，談判將聚焦於安全保障和領土問題。

They're not shying away from the big sticking points, are they?

他們並沒有迴避這些關鍵的癥結，對吧？

Well, these are still the big issues that need to be dealt with, if we can believe at least Mr.

嗯，如果我們至少相信川普先生的話，這些仍然是需要處理的重大問題，他說其他90%的擔憂都已經處理好了。

Trump, who says that 90% of all other concerns have been dealt with.

We heard just from your reporter in Kyiv those points.

我們剛才聽了來自基輔的記者說的那些重點。

I mean, the de facto loss of occupied regions on the side of Ukraine is already a big ask.

我的意思是，烏克蘭方面實際上已經失去佔領區，這已經是很難的要求了。

But to make it a further concession for Russia and that's the key issue there, isn't it?

但這對俄羅斯來說更是個讓步，這才是關鍵問題，對吧？

Because we have seen, I think we might have lost the line to Stephen Blockman's.

因為我們看到，我想我們可能和 Stephen Blockmans 的連線中斷了。

So I think we've managed to get you back.

所以我想我們已經成功讓你回來了。

So I think the line just froze there a minute.

所以我想剛才連線中斷了一分鐘。

But you're talking about possible compromises from Russia.

但你正在談論俄羅斯可能的讓步。

Because the point has been that where Ukraine has been willing to negotiate compromise over the last few years, Russia has not moved from its main points.

因為重點是，過去幾年烏克蘭一直願意談判妥協，但俄羅斯沒有從它的主要論點退讓。

而且我認為，從普丁先生的發言來看，例如在他今年的聖誕節或新年願望裡，俄羅斯並未準備好達成全面勝利，他也不會是以退讓。

Putin's statements, that over his Christmas or New Year's resolutions, for example, that total victory is within reach for Russia, that he will back down from those.

他似乎與川普先生產生了共鳴，這當然也加強了他自己的地位。

關於達成烏克蘭的和平協議，有什麼能改變現狀的嗎？

Trump, of course, and that has strengthened his own hand.

嗯，俄羅斯方面遭受的嚴重損失並沒有幫助。

What, if anything, could move the dial here when it comes to reaching a peace deal in Ukraine?

我認為最終還是要看國際壓力，以及對俄羅斯的真正孤立。

Well, severe losses on the Russian side haven't helped.

而川普先生在這方面並沒有提供幫助。

I think it's ultimately up to, you know, international pressure and really isolation of Russia.

川普先生受邀加入一個和平委員會。

Putin to join a board of peace breaks his isolation that the Europeans have tried to maintain in support of Ukraine.

這打破了歐洲國家為了支持烏克蘭而一直維持的孤立狀態。

So unless there's really an American shift on this, I don't see this going anywhere in 2026.

所以，除非美國在這方面真的有轉變，否則我認為這在 2026 年不會有任何進展。

On Thursday, we saw President Zelensky being critical of European countries, saying that they're not doing enough to support Ukraine.

週四，我們看到澤倫斯基總統批評歐洲國家，說他們沒有盡力支持烏克蘭。

The eu, we understand, is not part of these negotiations that will be happening in Abu Dhabi.

我們知道，歐盟並未參與即將在阿布達比舉行的這些談判。

Well, the EU as an organization is of course crucial in securing a final deal as far as the lifting of sanctions on Russia is concerned, for example, but

嗯，歐盟作為一個組織，當然在確保最終協議方面至關重要，例如解除對俄羅斯的制裁，但是

European nations leaders, including Keir Starmer or indeed Emmanuel Macron and others, they have been working on the sidelines of the US Led peace process, trying to influence it as best as they could.

包括基爾·斯塔默、伊曼紐爾·馬克宏等歐洲國家領導人，他們一直在美國主導的和平進程的幕後努力，盡力影響它。

Cooperation, of course, with Ukraine, but an institutional representation is not there.

當然是與烏克蘭合作，但並沒有機構性的代表。

It will have to be recognized at one point, probably latent to that process to secure the type of concessions that Mr.

遲早得承認，而且很可能是在那個過程中，才能確保川普先生，

Trump cannot, or Ukraine, for that matter, cannot deliver themselves.

或者說烏克蘭自己無法提供的讓步。

Stephen Blockmans from the Centre for European Policy Studies, thank you for joining us on BBC News.

歐洲政策研究中心（Centre for European Policy Studies）的 Stephen Blockmans，謝謝你參與 BBC 新聞的報導。