Name: 一個臺灣網友的神回覆，意外點燃了兩岸日戰火！BBC 亞洲特輯 podcast (How one Taiwan comment reignited a fiery China-Japan feud - Asia Specific podcast, BBC World Service)
Uploaded: 2025-11-27T03:56:02.000Z
Duration: 20 min 38 s

程度副詞

Almost a quarter of Japan's tourists are Chinese.

日本的遊客中，將近四分之一是中國人。

So there has been some reaction on Twitter, for example, putting China's advisory saying, you know, warning towards warning Chinese tourists not to go to Japan.

所以在 Twitter 上出現了一些反應，例如中國發布了旅遊警示，警告中國遊客不要前往日本。

And then, you know, some Japanese saying, well, okay, if you don't want to come, don't come.

然後，有些日本人就說，好吧，如果你們不想來，就別來了。

It started with what some call an off the cuff remark.

這源於一些人所說的 off the cuff remark。

Japan's new Prime Minister, Sanae Takaiji told parliament that if China were to use foreign force against Taiwan, it could create a survival threatening situation for Japan.

日本新任總理高市早苗告訴國會，如果中國對臺灣採取外力，可能會為日本製造生存威脅情況。

Under Japanese law, it's the threshold for military action.

根據日本法律，這是軍事行動的門檻。

China has summoned the Japanese ambassador over comments made by his prime minister on Taiwan.

中國召見日本大使，針對其總理就臺灣發表的言論。

Chinese officials accused Tokyo of crossing a red line and warned of sea serious consequences.

中國官員指責東京跨越紅線，並警告將有嚴重後果。

One senior diplomat posted a chilling violent message online.

一位資深外交官在網路上發布了一則令人不寒而慄的暴力訊息。

It was later deleted, but the tone was clear.

該訊息後來被刪除，但語氣已然清晰。

China has since returned to the United nations, summoned Japan's ambassador, suspended imports of Japanese seafood, issued travel warnings and cancelled cultural exchanges.

中國隨後向聯合國提出抗議，召見日本大使，暫停進口日本海鮮，發布旅遊警告，並取消文化交流。

Japan, in turn, has advised its citizens in China to stay vigilant.

日本反過來也建議在中國的公民保持警惕。

This hostility taps into a deep and bitter history between the two countries, from wartime memories to territorial disputes.

這種敵意源於兩國之間一段深刻而痛苦的歷史，從戰爭記憶到領土爭端。

But why did a single statement ignite tensions now?

但為何單一聲明會在現在點燃緊張局勢？

And could this latest spat spiral into something far uglier?

而這次最新的爭執是否會演變成更醜陋的局面？

I'm Marie Ko oyi in Singapore and this is the very first episode of Asia Specific, our brand new podcast from the BBC World Service.

我是 Marie Ko oyi 在新加坡，這是 BBC World Service 全新節目 Asia Specific 的第一集。

Twice a week we bring you Asia Pacific stories unpacked by those who know them best.

我們每週兩次為您帶來由最瞭解亞太地區的人們所解析的亞太故事。

And today I have the BBC's China correspondent, Laura Bicker in Beijing and also the BBC's Japan correspondent, Shaima Halil in Tokyo.

今天我邀請到 BBC 中國特派記者 Laura Bicker 在北京，以及 BBC 日本特派記者 Shaima Halil 在東京。

So good to have you both on Asia Pacific.

很高興你們兩位來到 Asia Pacific。

那我們就先從怎麼會走到這一步開始談起吧。

Shaima, because it wasn't like she was making a big speech about Taiwan, was she?

Shaima，因為她又不是在發表什麼關於臺灣的大演講，對吧？

She was basically answering a question in Parliament.

她基本上是在國會上回答一個問題。

But an opposition lawmaker had mentioned Taiwan.

但有位在野黨的國會議員提到了臺灣。

他有個具體的問題要問高市先生。

Kaichi asking in regards to Taiwan, what would constitute survival threatening situation.

高市女士，關於臺灣，什麼情況會構成生存威脅情況。

Survival threatening situation, because that's key language.

生存威脅情況，因為這是關鍵用語。

And then the prime minister, Sanai Takaichi responded with her own very specific language.

然後總理，高市早苗，用她自己非常具體的說法回應。

If there are battleships and the use of force, she said, when it comes to Taiwan, no matter how you think about it, it could constitute a survival threatening situation.

她說，如果出現戰艦和武力使用，關於臺灣，無論你怎麼想，都可能構成生存威脅情況。

That is a legal term in Japanese security law, which essentially means that the armed forces, any armed Attack on Japan's allies on Japan poses an existentialist threat to Japan, at which point Japan's SDF Self Defense Forces can get involved.

這是日本安保法中的一個法律術語，基本上意味著，任何對日本盟友的武裝攻擊，對日本構成生存威脅，屆時日本的自衛隊就可以介入。

I want to ask Laura about Beijing's reaction, but

我想問 Laura 關於北京的反應，但是

for viewers and listeners wondering why hypothetically Taiwan's invasion has anything to do with Japan's survival is, I guess the thinking is if Taiwan again was hypothetically invaded, you know, it could be Okinawa next, because China has spoken about Okinawa Ryukyu in the past.

對於那些想知道為什麼假設臺灣被入侵會跟日本的生存有關的觀眾和聽眾來說，我想他們的想法是，如果臺灣再次假設被入侵，你知道，下一個可能是沖繩，因為中國過去曾談論過沖繩琉球。

But Laura, in terms of Beijing's reaction, I mean, you know, we've seen violent protests before.

不過 Laura，就北京的反應而言，我的意思是，你知道，我們以前也見過激烈的抗議。

I remember, you know, back in 2012, because my uncle was living in China and there were violent anti Japan protests.

我記得，你知道，在 2012 年，因為我叔叔住在中國，當時有激烈的反日抗議。

Demonstrators were burning Toyota cars and so on.

But this language that this consulate General used, that's quite unprecedented, isn't it?

但這位總領事使用的這種語言，相當前所未聞，不是嗎？

And I think this is now the most serious diplomatic dispute between Japan and China since that kind of 2010, 2012 dispute.

我認為這是自 2010 年、2012 年那種爭執以來，日本和中國之間最嚴重的外交爭執。

It is worth pointing out that those protests on the street came, you know, they were organized protests in terms of rising anti Japanese sentiment.

值得指出的是，街頭的那些抗議活動，你知道，它們是為了日益高漲的反日情緒而組織的。

This is a year in which China has been commemorating the 80th anniversary of the end of World War II.

這是中國紀念二戰結束 80 週年的一年。

What it sees is its victory over Imperial Japan.

And all year there has been this rise in kind of anti Japanese sentiment.

而一整年來，這種反日情緒都在高漲。

We've seen it on state media, we've seen films commemorating the nanjing massacre where 200,000 unarmed civilians were, in the view of Chinese murdered by Imperial Japanese armies.

我們在官方媒體上看到過，也看過紀念南京大屠殺的電影，電影中提到中國認為有二十萬手無寸鐵的平民被日本帝國軍隊殺害。

So I think when it comes to the kind of rhetoric already within China, you've seen a rise of that sentiment.

所以我認為，就中國國內的言論而言，你已經看到這種情緒的興起。

然後當然，就出現了這些評論。

Now we've seen a bit of a return of what outside of China, they call the Wolf warrior, this kind of aggressive rhetoric that is used by both their politicians and their state media against, against countries that have allegedly wronged China.

現在我們看到了一點點回歸，在中國以外，他們稱之為「戰狼」，這種由他們的政治人物和官方媒體針對那些據稱傷害了中國的國家所使用的侵略性言論。

And for the last five years, the wolf warrior has gone a wee bit silent.

而在過去五年裡，「戰狼」稍微安靜了一點。

Until now, well and truly back, it would seem.

直到現在，看來是真正回來了。

You know, in terms of the kind of aggressive rhetoric, there's been saber rattling from the military.

就這種侵略性言論而言，軍方一直在進行武力展示。

They've said we've honed our skills through rigorous training.

他們說，我們透過嚴格的訓練磨練了我們的技能。

Former state media commentators have also called Ms. Takeichi a witch.

前官媒評論員也稱竹內女士為女巫。

Over the last week, there was a visit by a Japanese envoy to try to sort things out, to try to ease tensions, but

上週，一位日本特使來訪，試圖解決問題、緩和緊張局勢，但

First of all, when it came to the Chinese side, they didn't see the Japanese envoy as being high enough to be sent to sort out such what they see as a huge problem.

首先，就中方而言，他們認為來訪的日本特使不夠級別，不足以解決他們眼中如此重大的問題。

And second of all, he wore one of the Chinese delegates, a senior diplomat.

其次，他穿了中國代表、一位資深外交官所穿的一種服裝。

他穿了一種被稱為套裝的服裝。

It's got colorless suit with five buttons, and it was worn by students in 1919 who tried.

這是一種五顆鈕扣的無色套裝，是1919年試圖...的學生所穿的。

Chinese students who tried to overcome Japanese imperialism.

中國學生試圖克服日本帝國主義。

So it was seen as a sign of defiance on the Chinese side.

所以中方視其為一種挑釁的象徵。

the Japanese media's reaction was how, you know, the Chinese diplomat had his hands both in his pockets, whereas a Japanese official was seen to be bowing.

日本媒體的反應是，你知道，中國外交官雙手插在口袋裡，而日本官員則被看到在鞠躬。

You know, maybe he was bowing towards the translator.

你知道，也許他是在向翻譯鞠躬。

But, you know, that picture really went viral and some of the memes were quite, you know, hilarious, to be honest.

但是，你知道，那張照片真的爆紅了，有些梗真的很好笑，老實說。

I want to ask how locals feel about this, because, you know, reading the Japanese public's reaction, you know, when there were those protests in 2012, it was because of a territorial dispute.

我想問問當地人對此有什麼感覺，因為，你知道，讀了日本公眾的反應，你知道，2012年那些抗議活動是因為領土爭端。

So I think, you know, people can kind of understand that.

所以我想，你知道，人們可以有點理解這一點。

Takaichi, you know, I can see a lot of people going, what did she say that's so wrong?

我知道很多人會想，她說了什麼錯話嗎？

You know, because the language is so specific, and

因為，你知道，用語非常精確，

even, you know, not many people in Japan were aware that what she said was such a big deal.

甚至，你知道，在日本很多人都不知道她說的話是這麼大的事。

I think from the Japanese side, if you look at.

我認為從日本方面來看，如果你觀察。

If you look at the reaction, which I'm sure you've been.

如果你觀察反應，我確定你一定有。

You've been following the language that the experts use, the reaction from people on the streets is not as angry as what Laura has been saying on the Chinese side.

你一直關注專家們使用的語言，街上民眾的反應並沒有像 Laura 在中國那邊說的那麼生氣。

From where I'm sitting, it's more about watching what's going on, waiting for the ramifications, but

從我的角度來看，這更多是觀察正在發生的事情，等待後果，但是

also asking the question, what was it that was so outrageous?

也問了個問題，到底是什麼這麼離譜？

Because, again, remember, yes, Tokyo refused to retract, but

因為，再說一次，記住，是的，東京拒絕撤回，但是

she did promise to be more careful, in a way.

她確實承諾要更小心，某種程度上。

I shouldn't have said it the way I've said it, but, you know, this is our stance.

我不應該那樣說，但我說，你知道，這是我們的立場。

But do you think the fact that she's not withdrawing that comment, is it kind of almost benefiting her?

但你認為她沒有撤回那句話的事實，是不是反而有點對她有利？

因為在政治上，你知道，那個，那個。

In terms of the travel advisory that Beijing gave, one could argue that a lot of.

就北京發布的旅遊警示而言，可以說很多。

There were a lot of concerns about over tourism in Japan, and, you know, some people kind of cheering the fact that maybe there are fewer tourists.

有很多關於日本過度旅遊的擔憂，你知道，有些人甚至為遊客減少而感到高興。