Name: 哥倫比亞總統告訴 BBC：美國軍事行動威脅「真實存在」！| BBC 新聞 (Colombia sees 'real threat' of US military action, president tells BBC | BBC News)
Uploaded: 2026-01-09T16:58:10.000Z
Duration: 6 min 8 s

It seems to me that there's a problem in the United States that dates back decades.

在我看來，美國有個問題已經存在幾十年了。

程度副詞

情態副詞

The conception that the United States has held regarding its international relations under various administrations, it sees them as an empire without regard for the rights of nations, especially those of Latin America.

美國歷屆政府對待國際關係的觀念，就是將自己視為一個帝國，完全不顧其他國家的權利，尤其是拉丁美洲國家的權利。

As long as the United States economy is based on oil and coal, 70% of its energy matrix, that's enormous, it will tend to seek wars over oil and coal.

只要美國的經濟還是以石油和煤炭為基礎，佔其能源結構的70%，這非常龐大，它就會傾向於尋求石油和煤炭戰爭。

The Venezuelan issue is about this, in my opinion.

在我看來，委內瑞拉的問題就在於此。

If the United States and its policies were aligned with The Paris Agreement, that is, if they were to completely replace that 70% of its energy with clean energy, there would be no wars.

如果美國及其政策能與《巴黎協定》接軌，也就是說，如果他們能將這70%的能源完全替換成清潔能源，就不會有戰爭了。

There would be much more democratic and peaceful relationships with the world and South America.

與世界的關係，以及與南美洲的關係，將會更加民主與和平。

And President Trump has said that military action in Colombia sounds good.

而川普總統曾說過，在哥倫比亞採取軍事行動聽起來不錯。

How serious a threat do you think that is?

I do believe it's a real threat, and the prospect of removing it depends on the ongoing conversations.

我確實認為這是實際威脅，而消除這種威脅的前景，取決於持續的對話。

Colombia has already experienced military violence from the United States, most recently in Panama at the beginning of the 20th century.

哥倫比亞曾遭受過美國的軍事暴力，最近一次是在20世紀初的巴拿馬。

如今，巴拿馬已不再是哥倫比亞的一部分。

Colombia has lost territory many times, but this is just.

哥倫比亞失去領土的次數很多，但這只是。

So we don't think we're just talking for the sake of talking, and

所以我們不認為我們只是在空談，

even less so from the moment there was a verbal altercation in relations.

更何況是在關係中發生言語衝突之後。

President Trump has also said to you personally to watch your back.

川普總統也親口跟你說要小心。

How worried are you for your personal safety?

let's say that faced with the threat of the magnitude of such powerful army, such powerful military forces in Colombia, the response isn't exactly the same as what has happened in Venezuela.

假設面對如此強大的軍隊、如此強大的軍事力量在哥倫比亞的威脅，其回應與在委內瑞拉發生的情況並不完全相同。

Colombia's history shows how it has responded to large armies.

哥倫比亞的歷史顯示了它如何應對龐大的軍隊。

And can you be sure that the US Won't do to you, to Colombia, what it has done in Venezuela with Nicolas Maduro?

你能確定美國不會對你，對哥倫比亞做他們在委內瑞拉對尼古拉斯·馬杜羅做的事情嗎？

There was a major weakness in Nicolas Maduro, one that steamed from Venezuelan politics itself.

尼古拉斯·馬杜羅有一個重大的弱點，源於委內瑞拉政治本身。

A state of degradation of the process initiated by Chavez.

查維茲發起的過程出現了退化。

This led to a significant withdrawal of support from Venezuelan society.

這導致委內瑞拉社會的支持大幅減少。

I just spoke with Delsey, whom I've known for a long time.

我剛跟 Delsey 聊過，我認識她很久了。

Negotiations between Venezuelan forces must be between Venezuelan forces.

委內瑞拉軍隊之間的談判必須在委內瑞拉軍隊之間進行。

I don't know if it will happen, but I think it would be important.

我不知道會不會發生，但我認為這會很重要。

I believe we must focus our efforts primarily on national dialogue in Venezuela, toward a shared government that builds trust across all sectors of Venezuelan society, and

我相信我們必須將心力主要放在委內瑞拉的國家對話上，朝著建立信任的共享政府邁進，並

President Trump has also accused you personally of trafficking cocaine.

People voted for me because it has always been proven here that I'm not involved in that.

大家投票給我，因為在這裡一直都被證明我沒有涉入其中。

this is important, I have been fighting against the drug cartels at the cost of my family having to go into exile.

這很重要，我一直在對抗毒梟，甚至付出了我家人必須流亡的代價。

Should you have adopted a more tough military stance to tackle narco trafficking rather than just trying to talk?

你是不是應該採取更強硬的軍事立場來打擊毒品販運，而不是隻試圖談判？

What we've developed today is two simultaneous approaches.

我們今天發展出的是兩種同步進行的方法。

One, talking about peace with groups that are bandits.

一、跟那些土匪團體談判和平。

And the other, developing a military offensive against those who don't want peace.

二、同時，我們也在發展軍事攻勢，對付那些不想和平的人。

There are still ongoing negotiations in the south of the country where the greatest reduction in coca leaf cultivation has occurred.

在國內南部，也就是古柯葉種植減少最多的地方，仍然有持續的對話。

It's in the south of the country where the homicide rate in Colombia has fallen the most.

這是在哥倫比亞，殺人率下降最多的地方。

So let's say the policy of dialogue, as I just demonstrated, serves to de escalate violence.

所以，就像我剛才說的，對話政策有助於降低暴力。

And to that extent, we've carried out 1440 armed confrontations, capturing 14,000 members of these types of structures.

總的來說，我們進行了 1440 次武裝對抗，逮捕了這類組織的 14,000 名成員。

Finally, President, what do you want from the US now and what's your message to the American people?

總統先生，您現在希望美國做些什麼？您想對美國人民說些什麼？

Well, I think they need to reflect first, and we, Latin America, need to come together.

嗯，我認為他們需要先反思，而我們拉丁美洲需要團結起來。

Many people took to the streets in Venezuelan cities, a huge number of people in Colombian cities, and

許多人在委內瑞拉的城市走上街頭，哥倫比亞的城市也有大量民眾，

social unrest erupted in parts of the United States over an event unrelated to them, but

美國部分地區爆發了社會動盪，這起事件與他們無關，但

because of the murder of a citizen by ice.

卻是因為一名公民被 ICE 殺害。

For us, ICE operates the same way as the Nazi and Italian brigades, the fascists.

對我們來說，ICE 的運作方式就像納粹和義大利的旅，還有法西斯一樣。

And it has reached to the point where they no longer just persecute Latin Americans in the streets, which for us is an affront, but

甚至到了他們不再只是在大街上迫害拉丁美洲人，這對我們來說是種侮辱，而且

they also kill citizens of the United States.

So it's a matter for reflection, because if you look at all of this together, plus what could continue to develop, instead of a United States dominating the world, the imperial dream, it's a United States isolated from the world.

所以這是一個需要反思的問題，因為如果你把這一切結合起來看，再加上可能繼續發展的狀況，與其說是一個主宰世界的美國，一個帝國的夢想，不如說是一個與世界隔絕的美國。

And an empire is not built in isolation from the world.