Name: 人天生就邪惡嗎？犯罪學家解答疑惑 | 真心話箱 (Are People Born Evil? Criminologist Answers Questions | Honesty Box)
Uploaded: 2026-01-06T13:45:38.000Z
Duration: 28 min 3 s

Seven out of ten murder victims in the United Kingdom are men.

在英國，每十位謀殺案受害者中就有七位是男性。

Nine out of ten perpetrators of murder are men.

每十位謀殺案的加害者中就有九位是男性。

But the main reason people commit murder in this country is because in five minutes of madness, a young man will lash out at another young man whom he feels has disrespected him.

但在這個國家，人們犯下謀殺案的主要原因，是因為在一時的瘋狂中，年輕人會攻擊另一個他覺得不尊重他的年輕人。

I'm emeritus professor of criminology and I'm here to answer questions in the honesty box.

我是犯罪學的榮譽教授，今天來回答意見箱裡的問題。

Psychopaths don't have horns on their head or a long pointed tail.

精神病態者頭上沒有角，也沒有長長的尖尾巴。

You know, if it was that easy, it would be easy to spot a psychopath.

說真的，如果這麼容易辨識，那早就辦到了。

But psychopaths are very good at mirroring your behavior.

但精神病態者非常擅長模仿你的行為。

Psychopaths are very good at being plausible.

精神病態者很擅長表現得貌似有理。

Psychopaths are very good about being charming.

精神病態者也很擅長表現得很有魅力。

But effectively you spot a psychopath because the psychopath needs to get close to you as quickly as possible.

但你實際上辨識出精神病態者，是因為他需要盡快接近你。

Because if he gets close to you and learns about you, he's able to use that knowledge to manipulate you.

因為如果他接近你並瞭解你，他就能利用這些資訊來操縱你。

Because by manipulating you, he's able to live off you.

因為透過操縱你，他就能寄生在你身上。

They don't want to expend too much energy and therefore they can live off you by knowing the buttons to press, the way to impress you, the way to get money out of you.

他們不想耗費太多精力，是以他們可以透過知道該按什麼按鈕、該如何打動你、該如何從你那裡弄到錢來寄生在你身上。

The label gets used to very commonly in our culture, but

這個標籤在我們的文化中被非常普遍地使用，但是

only one in a hundred people would be clinically diagnosed as a psychopath.

只有百分之一的人會被臨床診斷為精神病態者。

所以這是一種非常罕見的現象。

And of those, one out of every hundred who would be diagnosed as such, 9 out of 10 would be male, as opposed to female.

而在這些被診斷出來的人當中，十個有九個是男性，而不是女性。

So this is a very, very rare phenomenon as opposed to the way that we just talk about it, but

所以這是一個非常、非常罕見的現象，跟我們平常說的不太一樣，但是

Often it's because, in my experience, they like power.

通常是因為，依我的經驗，他們喜歡權力。

And often it's a sense of power that they feel is denied to them in other aspects of their lives.

而且通常是一種他們覺得在生活中其他方面被剝奪的權力感。

And therefore by killing, they are exercising a godlike power.

是以透過殺人，他們正在行使一種神一般的權力。

They decide who should live and who should die.

It's not so much that one should be asking, it's why are some serial killers killing cycle longer than other serial killers killing cycle?

與其問這個，不如問為什麼有些連環殺手的殺人週期比其他連環殺手長？

That's about the fact that we've got to care.

這跟我們必須關心這件事有關。

That's about the fact that we've got to understand that serial killers will target particular groups in our culture who are vulnerable to attack.

這跟我們必須瞭解，連環殺手會鎖定我們社會中那些容易受攻擊的特定群體有關。

And it seems to me our responsibility is to try and lessen those vulnerabilities.

在我來看，我們的責任就是試著減輕這些脆弱性。

Is it true psychopaths mimic emotion and the answer to that is, yeah, that's exactly what they do.

精神病態者會模仿情緒是真的嗎？答案是，對，他們就是這麼做的。

Psychopaths have defective emotional experiences.

精神病態者有缺陷的情感體驗。

They don't know what sadness is, they don't know what happiness is.

他們不知道什麼是悲傷，也不知道什麼是快樂。

They know that you're sad or you're happy because they're very good at reading you.

他們之所以知道你悲傷或快樂，是因為他們非常擅長解讀你。

So if you're crying, they understand that sadness.

所以如果你在哭，他們會理解那種悲傷。

If you're smiling and happy and you're ha ha, laughing, they understand that's a different emotion.

如果你在笑，很開心，然後你哈哈大笑，他們會理解那是另一種情緒。

But they don't feel those emotions, they merely mimic those emotions.

但他們並沒有感受到那些情緒，他們只是在模仿那些情緒。

So they want to get close to you, they want to make you feel that they are like you.

所以他們想要接近你，他們想要讓你覺得他們跟你一樣。

So they are very good at mimicking emotions.

I mean, one of my best friends is a clinically diagnosed psychopath and he always, he's called Noel.

我的意思是，我最好的朋友之一是一位臨床診斷的精神病態者，他叫做 Noel。

And Noel always says to me, you know, I didn't know why people cried at the end of Titanic.

Noel 總是跟我說，你知道，我不知道為什麼人們會在鐵達尼號的結尾哭。

He doesn't have those emotions, but he knew everybody else was sad, but he didn't feel that sadness.

他沒有那些情緒，但他知道其他人都很難過，但他自己並沒有感受到那種悲傷。

I mean, imagine not being able to have genuine joy, being able to experience what being joyous really feels like.

我的意思是，想像一下無法真正感到快樂，無法體驗到快樂的真實感受。

Everybody loves thinking that their boyfriend, their girlfriend, their next door neighbour is a psychopath.

每個人都喜歡覺得自己的男友、女友、隔壁鄰居是個精神病態者。

這是一種非常罕見的臨床狀況。

You know, this is such a good question because even though I'm not religious, I have a secular view of evil and I do believe in evil and I've certainly met people that I would be happily, I would happily label as such.

你知道，這真是個好問題，因為即使我不是宗教人士，我對邪惡也有世俗的看法，而且我確實相信邪惡的存在，而且我肯定遇過一些人，我會很樂意，很樂意稱他們為如此。

We're into one of the classic questions of forensic psychology or indeed criminology.

我們要探討的是鑑識心理學或犯罪學的經典問題之一。

我們是天生的，還是後天造成的？

I always answer that question by saying it's a messy combination of the two.

我總是這樣回答這個問題：兩者都有，而且情況很複雜。

And we might be born in a way that we have a propensity for violence, but

我們天生可能就容易有暴力傾向，但是

how we are nurtured, how we are raised, the relationship that we have with our parents, with our siblings, with our extended family, with friends, how we are nurtured can ameliorate those things that we are born with.

我們如何被教養、如何成長、與父母、兄弟姊妹、親戚、朋友之間的關係，這些後天的影響可以改善我們天生的特質。

Or indeed it can make them, it can aggravate them, it can make them much worse.

或者，這些後天的影響確實會加劇、惡化這些天生的特質，讓它們變得更糟。

I thought about that question relatively recently because of Axel Ruda Cabana.

我最近因為 Axel Ruda Cabana 的事情，重新思考了這個問題。

And it was quite clear that when he was younger, his parents had been able to manage, control, help with the problems that this young man had.

顯然，在他年輕的時候，他的父母能夠管理、控制、幫助他解決問題。

But when he became a teenager, when he was no longer under the influence of his parents, as he had Once been, the more problematic aspects of his personality were given full reign.

但當他進入青少年時期，不再像過去那樣受到父母的影響時，他性格中更具問題的方面就完全顯現出來了。

Well, she said very little publicly because of course she's pleaded not guilty and is still maintaining her innocence after her conviction.

嗯，她公開說的話很少，因為她當然是認罪不罰，而且在被定罪後仍然堅稱自己無罪。

And therefore it's very difficult to know enough about her to be able to do her psychopathy check list on her.

是以，要了解她足夠多來對她進行精神病態檢查，是非常困難的。

The interesting thing I feel about Lucy Letby is just how polarizing she is.

我對 Lucy Letby 感到很有趣的一點是，她真的非常兩極化。

There are still people who are maintaining her innocence and a lot of those people are professional people.

還是有人堅稱她是無辜的，而且其中很多人都是專業人士。

They're doing it with the best intentions.

They believe there's been a miscarriage of justice.

他們認為有司法不公的情況發生。

And of course, in terms of the research that I did about nurses that will kill in a hospital setting, she is an outlier.

當然，就我對醫院裡會殺人的護士所做的研究來看，她確實是個特例。

You know, she didn't make her colleagues feel particularly nervous to be around her.

你知道，她並沒有讓她的同事覺得跟她相處時特別緊張。

With one or two exceptions, she doesn't quite fit in terms of the red flags that one would normally associate with nurses that would kill in the hospital setting.

除了少數一兩個人之外，她並不完全符合我們通常會聯想到在醫院裡會殺人的護士的警示特徵。

And, you know, she's middle class, she's nice, she's got a sing songy name.

而且，你知道，她是中產階級，她人很好，她的名字聽起來很悅耳。

Even one of the detectives who worked on the case described her as beige.

就連一位參與此案的偵探都形容她是個「平凡無奇」的人。

And I think people find it difficult to get their head around the fact that she could possibly be a serial killer.

我覺得大家很難理解，她怎麼會是個連環殺手。

Our most prolific serial killer was a trusted local GP in Manchester who murdered 215, perhaps as many as 260 of his largely female elderly patients.

我們最多產的連環殺手是曼徹斯特一位備受信賴的家庭醫生，他殺害了 215 位，甚至可能高達 260 位，多數是年長的女性病患。

You know, when Harold Shipman was first arrested and charged with murder, the other patients in his practice set up a Harold Shipman legal fighting fund to pay for his legal expenses.

你知道，當 Harold Shipman 最初被逮捕並被控謀殺時，他診所裡的其他病患還為他設立了一個 Harold Shipman 法律訴訟基金，來支付他的法律費用。

Again, it's interesting to me because of the argument that I made about, you know, the vulnerability of some groups to be attacked by serial killers.

這點對我來說很有意思，因為我曾提出過關於某些群體容易被連環殺手攻擊的論點。

The service he was offering that no other doctor offered in Manchester was home visits.

他提供的服務是曼徹斯特沒有其他醫生提供的，那就是到府看診。

Harold Shipman was often the only person who was visiting those elderly people from one week to the next.

Harold Shipman 常常是每週唯一會探訪這些長者的人。

Which is also one of the reasons why so often when they were murdered in their home, they were wearing their best clothes.

這也解釋了為什麼他們在家中被謀殺時，常常會穿上他們最好的衣服。

They dressed up because the doctor was, was coming to call.

他們會打扮是因為醫生要來拜訪了。

So I don't know, I wouldn't be able to diagnose if Lucy Letby is a psychopath, but

所以我不知道，我無法診斷 Lucy Letby 是不是精神病態者，但是

she is quite clearly our most recent female British serial killer and our most recent male British serial killer is Stephen Port, who murdered gay men.

她顯然是我們最近的英國女性連環殺手，而我們最近的英國男性連環殺手是 Stephen Port，他殺害了男同性戀者。

What is something all serial killers have in common?

所有的連環殺手有什麼共同點嗎？

Well, they all have in common that they'll target specific groups of people.

嗯，他們共同的點是都會鎖定特定族群的人。

You know, I've worked with so many serial murderers that People always are fascinated.

我認識太多連環殺手了，大家總是很好奇。

You know, did they have the McDonald triad of bedwetting fire starting, being cruel to animals?

你知道，他們是不是有麥當勞三症：尿床、玩火、虐待動物？

Is there something in the biology of the individual serial killer?

這是不是跟連環殺手個人的生理有關？

而且正如我一直說的，你知道，也許。

But actually, what's more interesting is who it is that they're able to kill.

但實際上，更有趣的是他們能夠殺害誰。

I move from that medical, psychological tradition to a structural tradition that looks at the people that get targeted by serial murderers.

我從這種醫學、心理學的傳統，轉向一種結構性的傳統，來探討那些被連環殺手鎖定的人。