Chances are near zero.

機會幾乎為零。

Near zero?

接近零？

What do you want from theory alone?

你只想從理論中得到什麼？

Christopher Nolan's modern cinematic masterpiece Oppenheimer is a surreal, brooding, and pensive story about a man driven to create an instrument of war that forever reshapes the globe.

克里斯托弗-諾蘭的現代電影傑作奧本海默》是一個超現實、憂鬱和沉思的故事講述的是一個男人受人驅使，創造了一種戰爭工具，它可以 永遠重塑全球。

I just want to create beautiful airplanes.

我只想創造出漂亮的飛機。

Like that?

這樣嗎？

Very graceful.

非常優雅

I have a long way to go.

我還有很長的路要走。

Hayao Miyazaki's The Wind Rises is also about a man driven to create an instrument of war that forever reshapes the globe, and yet it's not the surface level recounting of these two films that truly bond them together.

宮崎駿的《起風了》也是講述了一個人被驅使創造出一種戰爭工具，永遠 重塑全球，但它並沒有 對這兩部電影的表面敘述 將他們真正聯繫在一起。

It's the simple fact that they're both constructed around the unifying theme obsession.

這只是一個簡單的事實，它們是兩者都圍繞著一個統一的主題 "痴迷 "展開。

I wanted to study the new physics.

我想研究新物理學。

Was there nowhere here?

這裡什麼地方都沒有嗎？

I thought Berkeley had the leading theoretical physics department.

我還以為伯克利的理論物理學很領先呢部門：

Yes, once I built it.

是的，一旦我建造了它。

Before we get too deep into today's episode, please be sure to like, comment, and subscribe to Nerdstalgic.

在我們深入瞭解今天的節目之前，請您請務必點贊、評論和訂閱 Nerdstalgic。

The Wind Rises or literally translated from Japanese as The Wind Has Risen, the film is a sweeping biopic about Jiro Horikoshi, a man who has a burning passion for planes and the idea of flight.

風起雲湧》或直譯為日文原名為《風起了》、 該片是一部關於堀越二郎的傳記片、 一個對飛機和 "飛機 "這一概念充滿熱情的人的飛行。

You were talking in your sleep.

你在說夢話

He told me that airplanes are beautiful dreams.

他告訴我，飛機是美麗的夢。

So I'm going to make beautiful airplanes.

所以我要製作漂亮的飛機。

This eventually manifests as a career designing planes for the Japanese military.

這最終表現為設計飛機的職業生涯為日本軍方服務。

He will eventually design a terrible instrument of war, the Mitsubishi A6M Zero.

他最終將設計出一種可怕的戰爭工具、三菱 A6M 零式戰鬥機。

Despite the carnage that this device will inevitably wreak, Jiro is obsessed with flight and spends the whole movie pursuing this idea of perfecting the act of flying regardless of the ends that his ideas will ultimately be utilized for.

儘管這種設備不可避免地會造成大屠殺、二郎痴迷於飛行，整部電影都在追求飛行。無論如何都要完善飛行行為的想法 他的想法最終將用於何種目的。

Airplanes are beautiful cursed dreams, waiting for the sky to swallow them up.

飛機是被詛咒的美麗夢想，等待著天空的到來吞沒他們。

The film Oppenheimer, based on the book American Prometheus written by Kai Bird and Martin J. Sherwin,

根據《美國普羅米修斯》一書改編的電影《奧本海默由凱-伯德和馬丁-J-謝爾文撰寫、

positioned its protagonist J. Robert Oppenheimer as arguably the most important man who has ever lived, a scientist and mathematician who had wild theories of what the known universe held in store for mankind.

其主角羅伯特-奧本海默的位置可以說是有史以來最重要的人 他是一位科學家和數學家 對已知的宇宙有著天馬行空的理論 人類的未來。

Oppenheimer was recruited by the United States government to oversee and run a top secret enterprise known as the Manhattan Project, a clandestine operation

奧本海默被美國政府聘用監督和管理一個絕密企業，該企業被稱為 作為曼哈頓計劃的祕密行動

with the simple goal of constructing a weapon that could compete with the at the time theoretical menace of nuclear weapons.

其目的很簡單，就是要製造出一種能夠能與當時理論上的威脅相抗衡 核武器。

It's easy to see the surface level parallels between The Wind Rises and Oppenheimer.

不難看出表層起風了》與奧本海默之間的相似之處。

They're both films that center on driven men carrying out scientific pursuits based on what they think are imperatives spurred on by the mechanisms of war.

這兩部電影都講述了被逼無奈的男人們如何實施根據他們的想法追求科學 這些都是戰爭機制催生的迫切需要。

In The Wind Rises, Miyazaki has recurring dream sequences where Jiro interacts with Gianni Caproni, the Italian civil, electrical, and aeronautical engineer who designed numerous planes.

在《起風了》中，宮崎駿反覆出現夢境片段在這裡，二郎與意大利公民詹尼-卡普羅尼（Gianni Caproni）進行了交流、 電氣和航空工程師設計了眾多飛機。

Caproni is something of a mystical dream mentor for Jiro, giving him both encouragement and offering words of caution that the devices Jiro is working on will be used to kill enemy combatants in war.

對於二郎來說，卡普羅尼就像是一位神祕的夢想導師、既給他鼓勵，也給他忠告二郎正在研究的設備 將用於在戰爭中殺死敵方戰鬥人員。

However, Jiro does not heed this second part.

然而，二郎並沒有注意到這第二部分。

He repeatedly ignores the moral fallout of his actions in pursuit of accomplishing a task.

他一再無視自己行為的道德後果為了完成任務。

I wanted this design to use the latest aeronautical advances.

我希望這個設計能採用最新的航空技術。

Minimal drag will be the key.

儘量減少阻力是關鍵。

I pushed the design to the limits of technology.

我將設計推向了技術的極限。

It bears stating that both of the films in question are deeply autobiographical for the men who created them.

需要說明的是，這兩部電影對於創作這些作品的人來說，這些作品都帶有深深的自傳色彩。

In The Wind Rises, many of Jiro's biographical elements are evolved or altered to fit Miyazaki's actual life story, a perfect example being Jiro has a wife with tuberculosis and an insatiable desire to create,

在《起風了》中，二郎的許多傳記元素根據宮崎駿的實際生活進行演變或修改 故事，二郎 他的妻子患有肺結核，而他卻有著永不滿足的創作慾望、

two things that are very obviously part of Miyazaki's life with his mother having tuberculosis and his own relationship with creativity being famously fraught.

這兩樣東西很明顯是宮崎駿的母親患有肺結核 以及他自己與創造力的關係 是出了名的矛盾。

Similarly, Christopher Nolan obviously struggles with many of the issues that Oppenheimer does in his film.

同樣，克里斯托弗-諾蘭顯然與許多問題作鬥爭 奧本海默在他的電影中就是這樣做的。

Nolan obviously relates to Oppenheimer's struggle and his commitment to his work.

諾蘭顯然與奧本海默的鬥爭有關以及他對工作的承諾。

There seems to be some sort of personal metaphor interlaced with how Oppenheimer's personal indiscretions and shortcomings--like literally abandoning his son in favor for his work--strike a deep chord with Nolan personally.

似乎有某種個人隱喻交織在一起奧本海默的個人不檢點行為 和缺點--比如 棄子從工--罷工 與諾蘭本人產生了深深的共鳴。

Is making a movie the same as inventing nuclear weapons?

拍電影和發明核武器一樣嗎？

From looking at his work, it's easy to come away with the idea that Nolan views himself as someone who is shouldering the weight of the world, and that's exactly how he depicts Oppenheimer,

從他的作品中，我們很容易得出這樣的想法諾蘭認為自己肩負著 世界的重量，這就是 他對奧本海默的描繪正是如此，奧本海默註定是一個

a man destined for so much greatness that his personal life is almost required to be thrown by the wayside.

他是如此偉大，以至於他的個人生活幾乎需要被丟棄在一旁。

Now it's your turn to deal with the consequences of your achievement.

現在輪到你承擔後果了你的成就。

However, the more interesting discussion to have is to analyze how each of these men deal with the magnitude of the negative side effects that each of the inventions in question have had on global culture.

然而，更有趣的討論是就是要分析這些人各自是如何 處理負值的大小 每項有關發明 對全球文化的影響。

Miyazaki chooses to portray Jiro as the criminally naive man, driven by the insatiable desire to conquer a technical problem.

宮崎駿選擇將二郎塑造成一個天真爛漫的人征服技術難題的慾望驅使著他們。

How that solution is eventually used is of relatively little interest to him.

最終如何使用該解決方案相對而言，他並不感興趣。

It's the puzzle at hand and his passion for flight that pushes him onward, but even more disturbingly, Miyazaki doesn't seem particularly interested in drawing a clear picture that what Jiro is doing is wrong.

是眼前的難題和他對飛行的熱情但更令人不安的是，他還在繼續前進、 宮崎駿似乎並不特別有興趣清楚地描繪出二郎正在做的事情 是錯誤的。

In Nolan's film, Oppenheimer repeatedly says that he's not sure any global government should have the power to ignite nuclear war, but he definitely knows the German military should not be allowed to have access to this power first.

在諾蘭的電影中，奧本海默多次他說，他不確定任何全球政府是否應該 有引爆核戰爭的能力，但他絕對 知道德國軍隊不應該 首先要允許獲得這種權力。

Therefore, there is no choice but to pursue the very technology that could unmake the world.

是以，除了追求這種技術可能會顛覆世界。

Does this moral relativism absolve the character from further scrutiny?

這種道德相對主義是否可以免除免於進一步審查？

It shouldn't, but that's about as far as Nolan goes for the first hour and a half of the film's runtime.

不應該這樣，但也只能這樣了諾蘭在影片的前一個半小時裡 運行時間。

Nolan depicts Oppenheimer's dogged crusade as just and true one.

諾蘭描繪了奧本海默的頑強鬥爭是公正和真實的。

He never pushes back against his subject or provides any truly questioning moments until almost two hours into the movie when it's been revealed that Germany has lost the war, but the bomb must be finished.

他從不迴避自己的主題或提供任何真正的質疑 直到影片開始近兩個小時後，我才發現 德國已經輸掉了戰爭、 但炸彈必須完成。

And then the US government decides to utilize it on the Japanese people.

然後美國政府決定利用它日本人民。

We intend to demonstrate it in the most unambiguous terms twice, once to show the weapon's power and a second to show that we can keep doing this until they surrender.

我們打算用最明確的語言來證明這一點兩次，一次顯示武器的威力 第二步是表明我們可以繼續這樣做，直到他們 投降。

Nolan seems to be reverential in Oppenheimer at nearly every turn as in the man's flaws were the only possible solution when taken in the context of his duty and calling to the literal fate of humankind.

諾蘭似乎對奧本海默充滿敬意幾乎在每一個轉捩點，因為在該男子的缺陷是唯一的 從他的職責角度看可能的解決辦法 並呼喚著人類的命運。

On the surface, it appears as if Nolan is attempting to construct a full portrait of a man.

從表面上看，似乎諾蘭正試圖勾勒出一個人的完整肖像。

However, he still never fully delves into the fallout or cost of Oppenheimer's actions either interpersonal or professional.

然而，他仍然沒有完全深入調查奧本海默行為的後果或代價 無論是人際關係還是職業關係。

Similarly, Miyazaki depicts Jiro's dedication to his work even when the character should be caring for his ailing partner Nyoko as a noble thing.

同樣，宮崎駿也描繪了二郎對工作的執著追求即使該字元應該是 照顧生病的伴侶 Nyoko 是一件高尚的事情。

It's apparent that to Miyazaki, the process of attempting to conquer the seemingly impossible and the dedication to one's work are the highest calling, even when there are people literally dying of tuberculosis in your immediate vicinity.

顯然，對宮崎駿來說，這個過程試圖征服看似不可能的事情 和對工作的奉獻精神是最高的要求 即使真的有人死於肺結核 在您的附近。

You work better when you're holding my hand.

牽著我的手，你才能更好地工作。

You're right.

你說得對。

If only I could leave my hand right here for the test flight.

如果我能把手放在這裡試飛就好了。

Both films are driven forward by the idea of obsession, largely because both filmmakers obviously relate to the protagonists through their understanding and lived experience with being obsessed.

這兩部電影都是由 "痴迷 "這一概念推動的、主要是因為兩位電影製作人顯然通過理解與主角產生共鳴 的生活經歷。

In some ways, both of these films are the most personal and most autobiographical pieces either filmmaker has produced and therein lies a potential reason for why each of them refuses to fully explore the moral relativism surrounding their protagonist.

在某些方面，這兩部電影是最個人化、最自傳性的 任何一位電影製作人的作品，而這正是 它們各自的潛在原因 拒絕充分探討圍繞道德相對主義的 他們的主角。

Why is it that Nolan did not depict any actual wartime conflict in Oppenheimer?

為什麼諾蘭沒有描繪任何真實的戰時場景？奧本海默的衝突？

Why is it that Miyazaki never chose to have a robust deconstruction of the futility of attempting to use the mechanisms of war to pursue your passions of creation?

為什麼宮崎駿從不選擇以有力的方式解構試圖 利用戰爭機制追求 您的創作激情？

Maybe that's because too close an examination of these characters would force the directors to examine themselves and come away seeing something they didn't like,

也許這是因為過於仔細地研究這些角色將迫使導演們審視 他們看到了自己不喜歡的東西、

or maybe they just realized that the men in questions obsession caused death on a scale previously undreamt of.

或者，他們只是意識到，這些人痴迷於造成的死亡人數之多，前所未見。

And that would just be too hard to handle.

那就太難處理了。

Well, that's all we have for this episode.

好了，本期節目到此結束。

What do you think?

你怎麼看？

Did Nolan and Miyazaki each handle the subject matter at hand accurately?

諾蘭和宮崎駿是否各自處理了題材是否準確？

Let us in the comments below.

請在下方評論中告訴我們。

And as always, please like, comment, and subscribe to Nerdstalgic to stay up to date with everything we've got going on.

請一如既往地點贊、評論和訂閱通過 Nerdstalgic 隨時瞭解我們的最新動態。 了。