Name: 傑夫里斯上場！「不擇手段」玩轉選區劃分，目標是？！ (Top Dem Jeffries goes all in on gerrymandering: ‘Whatever it takes’)
Uploaded: 2026-02-15T17:10:03.000Z
Duration: 10 min

程度副詞

So you clearly think that you now have an advantage in this gerrymandering race that we've really seen play out in unprecedented ways across the country this cycle.

所以你很清楚認為，在這次我們真的看到全國各地以前所未見的劃分選區競賽中，你們現在佔了優勢。

Do you think that Democrats are going to gerrymander their way to the majority?

你覺得民主黨會透過劃分選區來贏得過半數席次嗎？

Well, we're not going to gerrymander our way to the majority.

嗯，我們不會透過劃分選區來贏得過半數席次。

We are going to win the majority because the American people know that Republicans have gone way too far.

我們要贏得過半數席次，因為美國人民知道共和黨已經做得太過火了。

They're rejecting the extremism of Republicans and embracing the fact that Democrats have made clear we're going to work hard to, to lower the high cost of living, to fix our broken health care system, to reform the out of control ICE situation and to clean up corruption.

他們正在拒絕共和黨的極端主義，並接受民主黨已經明確表示，我們會努力降低高昂的生活成本、修復我們破碎的健保系統、改革失控的 ICE 情況，並肅清貪腐。

So there was a big ruling in Virginia that just came down the pike here.

所以，維吉尼亞州最近有一個重要的裁決。

Potentially this will go as a ballot referendum in April to voters in Virginia to decide whether or not to give you guys up to four more seats.

這可能會在四月以投票公投的形式交由維吉尼亞州的選民決定，是否要讓你們多贏得四個席次。

This will be a 10:1 difference between Democrats and Republicans in a pretty purple state.

這將是個在一個相當搖擺州的民主黨和共和黨之間十比一的差距。

Is this overreaching on the Democrats part?

Republicans started this redistricting war and Democrats have made clear we're going to finish it.

共和黨發起了這場選區重劃的戰爭，而民主黨已經明確表示，我們會把它終結。

We're going to make sure that there is a fair national map.

我們會確保有一個公平的全國選區劃分。

So at the end of the day, it's the voters who get to decide who's in the majority after the November midterm elections and not Donald Trump.

所以說到底，是選民決定誰能在十一月的期中選舉後成為多數黨，而不是唐納·川普。

That's the Democratic approach and the Republicans are feeling it.

這就是民主黨的做法，共和黨也感受到了。

I mean, when they go low, you're going lower.

我的意思是，他們卑鄙，你就更卑鄙。

We're going to make sure that there's a fair national map.

Donald Trump is the one who instructed five different Republican states to gerrymander the national congressional map.

唐納·川普訓示了五個不同的共和黨州進行劃分選區來制定全國國會選區圖。

And the reason why he did that is because he wanted to rig the midterm elections.

他這麼做的原因，是因為他想操縱期中選舉。

And for whatever the reason, they didn't think that Democrats were going to forcefully respond.

不管是什麼原因，他們都沒想到民主黨會強硬反擊。

They thought we wouldn't respond in California.

他們以為我們不會在加州反擊。

They thought we wouldn't respond in Virginia.

他們以為我們不會在維吉尼亞反擊。

They thought we wouldn't win the litigation in Utah.

他們以為我們不會贏得猶他州的訴訟。

They thought we wouldn't force a referendum in Missouri.

他們以為我們不會在密蘇裡州推動公投。

They thought we wouldn't successfully push them back in Ohio.

他們以為我們不會在俄亥俄州成功反擊。

And now they're feeling the consequences.

So do you think that you have the advantage here come November on this issue of gerrymandering?

所以，你認為到了十一月，在劃分選區這個議題上，你們佔優勢嗎？

The best case scenario for Republicans at this point is status quo, which is very different than what they were claiming when they were beating on their chests last year saying they were going to gerrymander our opportunities out of existence.

對共和黨來說，目前最好的情況就是維持現狀，這跟他們去年拍胸脯說要劃分選區來剝奪我們的機會時的說法，可是差很大。

In fact, some of them said, we're going to pick up 10 or 12 or 15 seats.

事實上，他們有些人說，我們要贏得十席、十二席，甚至十五席。

So you said they tried to rig the elections.

The other side may say, well, that's exactly what the Democrats are doing.

另一方可能會說，這正是民主黨在做的事。

They're trying to rig the elections now, too.

No, we're forcefully making sure that the overall national map is free and fair.

不，我們正在強力確保全國地圖是自由且公平的。

And so whatever advantage Republicans thought they were going to obtain by gerrymandering in red states across the country, we are making sure those advantages are completely and totally wiped out.

所以，無論共和黨認為他們透過在全國各地的紅色州劃分選區能獲得什麼優勢，我們都會確保這些優勢被徹底抹除。

How much money are you guys willing to spend on Virginia now?

你們打算花多少錢在維吉尼亞州？

This is going to go to a ballot referendum in April.

Could have a huge impact on the midterms.

這可能會對期中選舉產生巨大影響。

How much money are you guys willing to put in to get this ballot initiative through?

你們願意花多少錢來推動這項投票提案？

It could be several multimillion dollar campaigns.

可能會是幾個數百萬美元的競選活動。

We will spend tens of millions of dollars to make sure that the Republicans do not successfully manipulate voters in Virginia and that voters have all of the information necessary to make a decision around whether they want Donald Trump to rig the midterm elections and halt the ability for the American people to decide who's in the majority, or whether the people of Virginia and the people of America should be the ones to decide.

我們將花費數千萬美元，確保共和黨無法成功操縱維吉尼亞州的選民，並確保選民擁有做出決定所需的所有資訊，來決定他們是否希望唐納·川普操縱期中選舉，並阻止美國人民決定誰佔多數，或者維吉尼亞州人民和美國人民應該是決定者。

Do you worry about the cash situation with these outside groups?

你們擔心這些外部團體的現金狀況嗎？

I mean, the DNC, we're sitting in the DNC building right now.

我的意思是，民主黨全國委員會，我們現在就坐在民主黨全國委員會的辦公室裡。

The RNC had $100 million more than the DNC at the beginning of this year.

共和黨全國委員會今年初比民主黨全國委員會多了 1 億美元。

Well, it's not surprising that when one party has the White House, that the rnc, of course, is going to be in a somewhat stronger position financially than the DNC in the off year.

嗯，這並不令人意外，當一個政黨掌控白宮時，共和黨全國委員會在財政上當然會比民主黨全國委員會處於更有利的地位，尤其是在非選舉年。

Let's talk about Maryland, because it's a fight within your own party.

我們來談談馬裡蘭州，因為這是你們黨內的鬥爭。

The governor, Wes Moore, is backing this plan to redraw the one Republican essentially out of his district.

州長 Wes Moore 支持這項計畫，要將一名共和黨籍的眾議員逐出他的選區。

這項計畫已經通過州眾議院，但

it's being held up in the state Senate by one man, the State Senate president, Bill Ferguson.

在州參議院被一名參議員卡住了，他就是州參議院議長 Bill Ferguson。

Bill Ferguson, who's not bringing this to the floor for a vote.

Bill Ferguson 並沒有將這項提案送交表決。

What are the implications if he continues to stand against you and your party?

如果他繼續阻擋你和你的黨，會有什麼後果？

Well, I'm not convinced that he's going to be successful.

Governor Moore has been incredibly strong, resilient, patriotic, and visionary on this issue.

摩爾州長在這個議題上一直非常堅定、有韌性、愛國且有遠見。

I'm very thankful to the Maryland House of Delegates who decisively passed this legislation, which, by the way, is going to give voters the opportunity in Maryland to make a decision about the future of this map.

我非常感謝馬裡蘭州眾議院果斷通過了這項法案，順帶一提，這將讓馬裡蘭州的選民有機會決定這份選區圖的未來。

That's the difference between Democrats and Republicans.

這就是民主黨和共和黨的差別。

They are passing maps that they are intentionally gerrymandering, often wiping away black or Latino districts in the dead of night legislatively because they're petrified of taking these things to the voters.

他們通過的選區圖是故意劃分選區，經常在深夜透過立法手段，抹去黑人或拉丁裔選區，因為他們害怕將這些事情交給選民決定。

That was done in California, that's being done in Virginia, and

這在加州已經做過，在維吉尼亞州也正在做，

that also is the legislation that is being undertaken and considered in Maryland now.

這也是目前在馬裡蘭州正在進行和考慮的法案。

If he stands firm, could he cost you the majority, this Democratic State Senate president in Maryland?

如果他堅持己見，這位馬裡蘭州的民主黨參議院議長，會不會讓你失去多數席次？

Well, he'd have to live with that if that's the outcome at the end of the day.

不過，如果最後結果是這樣，他只好接受。

But I don't think that's gonna be the outcome because we know we have majority support right now as we speak in the Maryland State Senate.

但我認為結果不會是這樣，因為我們知道，就目前而言，我們在馬裡蘭州參議院擁有過半數的支持。

And all we're asking President Ferguson to do is allow democracy to prevail.

我們只希望佛格森議長讓民主得以伸張。

One man shouldn't stand in the way of the people of Maryland, through their representatives in the State Senate, being able to decide, should we go in this direction or should we not?

一個人不應該阻礙馬裡蘭州人民，透過他們的州參議院代表，決定我們應該朝這個方向走還是不走？

Answer Donald Trump's continued efforts to rig the midterm election.

回應川普持續試圖操縱期中選舉的努力。

He seems to be concerned that this could lead to legal challenges and it could even backfire for your party.

他似乎擔心這可能會導致法律訴訟，甚至可能對你們黨不利。

I haven't spoken to Ferguson in several weeks.

我已經好幾個星期沒跟 Ferguson 說話了。

Well, at some point I'm gonna have to have a conversation with him if he continues to stand in the way of an up or down vote.

嗯，如果他繼續阻擋直接表決，我遲早得跟他談談。

But hopefully over the next few days, he'll change his mind.

不過希望接下來幾天他會改變心意。

Okay, so there's also the possibility that the Supreme Court could really change things on the Voting Rights Act.

好的，最高法院也有可能真的改變《投票權法》的相關規定。

Does that worry you that the Supreme Court could come in and really undermine your chances to take back the majority?

你擔心最高法院介入，嚴重影響你們贏回多數席次的機會嗎？

I think it's important for the Supreme Court to stay consistent.

我認為最高法院保持一致性很重要。

And just two years ago or so in the Alabama case, Justice Roberts and Justice Kavanaugh affirmed the continued importance of section 2 of the Voting Rights Act.

而且就在大約兩年前的阿拉巴馬州案中，羅伯茨大法官和卡瓦諾大法官確認了《投票權法》第二條的持續重要性。

So I have no idea why two or three years later they would overturn their own decision.

所以我不知道為什麼兩三年後他們會推翻自己的決定。

Particularly in this environment where Donald Trump has launched an all out assault on civil rights, on, on voting rights, on black history, on these principles of diversity and equity.

尤其是在唐納·川普對民權、投票權、黑人歷史、多元化和公平原則發動全面攻擊的這種環境下。

And why, in this environment where we're seeing a resurgence of racism and oppression, could the Supreme Court possibly conclude that the Voting Rights act is outdated but if they do, what does that mean for your chances to take back the House?

而且，在我們看到種族主義和壓迫復甦的這種環境下，最高法院怎麼可能認為《投票權法》已經過時了，但如果他們這麼做，那對你們贏回眾議院的機會意味著什麼？

Well, I think the interesting thing is that if for whatever the reason, they allow certain states in the Deep south to reopen the congressional map, that doesn't mean that every other state in other parts of the country, including the north, the Midwest and the west can't do exactly the same thing.

嗯，我認為有趣的是，無論出於何種原因，如果他們允許深南部的一些州重新開放國會選區圖，這並不意味著全國其他地區，包括北部、中西部和西部，都不能做同樣的事情。

So I would caution Republicans, be careful what you wish for.

所以我會警告共和黨人，小心你們許下的願望。

They've already gone down this road once before and they've seen the outcome.

他們以前已經走過這條路一次了，他們看到了結果。

This whole gerrymandering scheme has completely and totally backfired on them.

整個劃分選區的計劃已經完全、徹底地適得其反了。

Do they want to double down on that failed effort?

他們想加倍投入那項失敗的努力嗎？

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傑夫里斯上場！「不擇手段」玩轉選區劃分，目標是？！ (Top Dem Jeffries goes all in on gerrymandering: ‘Whatever it takes’)

majority

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