Name: 索娜認為柯南應該讀《格雷的五十道陰影》（ ft. 肯·伯恩斯）| 柯南需要一個朋友 (Sona Thinks Conan Should Read "Fifty Shades Of Grey" (Ft. Ken Burns) | Conan O'Brien Needs A Friend)
Uploaded: 2026-03-26T16:39:42.000Z
Duration: 5 min 12 s

動名詞

One thing is that I have read hi I'm addicted to reading history, and

而我，嗯，我太太喜歡看小說，

she's always trying to get me to read fiction as if eating my vegetables.

她總是試圖讓我讀小說，就像吃我的蔬菜一樣。

And, um, I just have this burning desire to know what happened.

然後，嗯，我就是有一種強烈的渴望想知道發生了什麼事。

And if she's reading this wonderful, powerful novel, I'm like, "Eva, what happened?

如果她在讀這本很棒、很有力量的小說，我就會說：「Eva，發生了什麼事？

That's just made up!" And so she has wonderful photos of me when we've gone on vacations over our long marriage, on different beaches in different beautiful settings, reading the most turgid, dark, uh, books about, you know, uh, the Gulag.

那只是編造的！」所以，在她們漫長的婚姻中，我們去度假時，她有我很多很棒的照片，在不同的海灘、不同的美麗場景，讀著最枯燥、黑暗的書，關於，你知道，嗯，古拉格。

And I'm sitting there with, like, a rum punch next to me.

然後我就坐在那裡，旁邊放著一杯蘭姆潘趣酒。

But she could be reading, you know, Schultz and Nietzsche, or, you know.

但她可能會在讀，你知道，舒茲和尼采，或是，你知道。

she's always reading, um, you know, she's reading great stuff, and she has convinced me.

而且她總是在閱讀，嗯，你知道，她在讀很棒的東西，而且她說服了我。

No, no, no, there is as much drama in what was and what is as anything the human imagination makes up.

不，不，不，過去和現在之間有著和人類想像力所創造的任何東西一樣多的戲劇性。

But it's not a choice, because you're gonna lose Shakespeare if you're not gonna let people make stuff up, right?

但這不是一個選擇，因為如果你不讓人們編造東西，你就會失去莎士比亞，對吧？

You're gonna lose a lot of wonderful insight that comes from whatever the license is that people take to sort of focus on our interior lives and why we're here and what we're supposed to be doing and making of it.

你會失去很多美妙的見解，這些見解來自於人們為了專注於我們的內心生活、我們為何在此、我們應該做什麼以及如何看待它而採取的任何自由。

I have to say, even one of my probably my favorite book is a historical novel, um, The Killer Angels, which is— That's what got me into the to do The Civil War.

我得說，我最喜歡的書之一是一本歷史小說，嗯，《殺手天使》，這就是–這讓我開始製作《內戰》。

I finished reading it on Christmas Day, 1984.

I was visiting my dad in Michigan, um, and

那時候我正在密西根看我爸，嗯，

I said, "I know what I'm gonna do for my next film." And he said, "What's that, son?" And I said, "The Civil War." And he goes, "What part?" And I said, "All of it." And he just shook his head and walked out of the room.

然後我說：「我知道我接下來要拍什麼電影了。」他說：「什麼電影，兒子？」我說：「《內戰》。」他說：「哪一部分？」我說：「全部。」他就搖搖頭走出了房間。

And, um, it was it was because The Civil War had been looming over all the subjects of the film I'd made in really bizarre ways on the on the Brooklyn Bridge, on the Shakers, on the Statue of Liberty, on on the Congress, on Thomas Hart Benton, on on all the stu Huey Long, all of the stuff I had done, and

嗯，那時候是因為《內戰》這部電影，在我拍過的電影裡，以各種奇特的方式，像是關於布魯克林大橋、關於謝克爾人、關於自由女神像、關於國會、關於湯瑪斯·哈特·班頓、關於休伊·朗，所有我做過的這些事，

that I just couldn't figure out that this seemed to be as Shelby Foote once said, you know, "It's a American history is this clear river that flows into a bloody lake that flows out clear again." Not true.

我就是搞不懂，就像謝爾比·富特曾經說過的：「美國歷史是一條清澈的河流，流入一片血腥的湖泊，然後又再次流出，變得清澈。」這根本不對。

But the idea that everything has to pass through The Civil War was important to it.

但所有的一切都必須經過《內戰》的洗禮，這個想法對它很重要。

所以，對，我是說，《殺死天使》。

你有讀過馬庫斯·詹姆士寫的《烏鴉》嗎？

Very antiquated, uh, book, uh, um, 1920s.

非常老派，呃，書，呃，嗯，1920年代的。

He won the Pulitzer Prize, I think, for this or another one.

他贏得了普立茲獎，我想，是為了這本書或另一本。

He did a biography first on Andrew Jackson, but

他先寫了安德魯·傑克遜的傳記，

then he did one that The Raven is on Sam Houston.

但後來他寫了關於山姆·休士頓的《烏鴉》。

And there is so much that happens to Sam Houston before he's even heard of the word Texas.

山姆·休士頓在聽到德州這個詞之前，發生了好多事。

I mean, he is this close to the presidency.

我的意思是，他離總統之位就差這麼一點。

He's sort of holding the governorship, uh, while Andrew Jackson is, is, uh, president.

他有點像是暫代州長職位，呃，當時安德魯·傑克遜是、是、呃，總統。

He's gonna be the next president for sure.

He marries this young girl, his wife, and at some moment, she leaves him.

他娶了這個年輕女孩，他的妻子，然後在某個時刻，她離開了他。

No, we do not know to this day why she did.

不，我們到今天都不知道她為什麼這麼做。

Something sexual, an old lover, whatever it was.

可能是性方面的，舊情人，或是任何原因。

He went to what is now Memphis, swam across the Mississippi, and

他去了現在的曼菲斯，遊過密西西比河，

became big drunk, a kind of dangerous, loose cannon Indian agent across the Mississippi.

然後在密西西比河對岸變成一個喝醉酒、危險、不受控制的印第安事務官。

I mean, it's just about if somebody gave me $180 million and said you had to do a feature film, I'd do The Life of of Sam Houston based on on this.

我的意思是，如果有人給我一億八千萬美元，要我拍一部長片，我會根據這個拍山姆·休士頓傳。

Well, you know, it's these there's so many things that really happened in our history and just in history in general that if you wrote it as a screenplay, someone would say, "Eh, this is too much." You know what I mean?

嗯，你知道，我們歷史上，以及歷史上發生了太多事情，如果把它寫成劇本，有人可能會說：「嗯，這太誇張了。」你懂我意思嗎？

You know, Avatar is more believable than this.

說真的，《阿凡達》都比這個可信。

This is you got a little crazy here when he swims across the river and you think, "No, no, this is all." All true.

這邊你有點瘋了，他遊過河，你會想：「不行不行，這都是真的。」全是真的。

And I think that's what's always attracted me so much to it.

我覺得這就是一直以來這麼吸引我的地方。

I got into it and I realized, "Oh, it's just stories." And, you know, Sona's always giving me a hard time.

我也跟著迷上，然後我發現：「喔，這其實就是故事。」而且，你知道，Sona 總是在找我麻煩。

You always make fun of me for reading so much history.

Well, you read a lot of history, but, like, you don't read, like, Fifty Shades Of Grey, for instance.

嗯，你讀很多歷史，但像是，你不會讀《格雷的五十道陰影》那種書。

I've recommended books to you and you completely ignore me.

我推薦書給你，你都完全不理我。

你有看過《格雷的五十道陰影》嗎？

Okay, this is your next your next this is your next documentary, Ken.

好，這部就是你下一部紀錄片了，Ken。

I did the blue and the grey, but I— No, no.

我做了藍色和灰色的，但我— 不，不。

It's like the blue and the grey, but a little different.

就像藍色和灰色，但有點不一樣。