The healthy hair cell divides frequently.

健康的毛髮細胞分裂頻繁

And the cancer cell divides even more frequently and recklessly.

而癌細胞分裂得 更加頻繁也更不受限制

"The first draft that I saw was, like,

「我看到的初稿時，我以為

four days before it was supposed to go online

這好像四天前 本來就得在網上放映的

or something like that,

或之類的

and I hadn't heard, you know I hadn't heard, so, I was like,

我沒聽說過這個，你知道 我沒聽說過，所以我就問：

'Hey, guys, just wondering if you need me for anything?'

『嘿，你們是否需要我的幫助？』

You know?

你知道嗎？

And so she floods my inbox with emails, being like,

她把電子郵件塞爆我信箱，說：

'Yes, we actually need you for a bunch of stuff!'

『是的，我們超需要你！』

And it was great.

這太棒了

Like, when I first saw it,

當我第一次看到它

I mean, you immediately get the whole natural versus unnatural technique."

你可以一眼就了解整個 自然和整個非自然技術的對立。」

"Not good for you?"

「你覺得不好嗎？」

"Right, yes, there you go,

「是的，問題就在這兒

good for you and not good for you.

你覺得不錯，也覺得有點不好

Seeing that, actually, was really cool

這種情況其實真的很酷

because, I mean, I had no idea.

因為，我的意思是

Writing the script, you have no idea

在寫腳本時

what it's going to turn out like in the end.

你根本不知道，它到底會怎麼結束

But you get this, like, intuitive feel of

但你知道，這像一種直覺

'Okay, like, yeah, I get why this is a cancer cell,

「好吧，是的，我明白 為什麼這是癌症細胞

and I get why this is a healthy cell.'

我也理解為什麼 這是一個健康的細胞。」

And, actually, I showed it to,

而且，其實我演示過它

I showed an early draft to the professor

我把最初的腳本拿給我教授看

with whom I was fact-checking the script

我和他一起檢查腳本

who is a cancer researcher at MIT,

他是麻省理工學院的癌症研究員

and he said that it was one of the best visualizations

他說這是他所見過的

of cancer cells that he'd ever seen.

最佳癌症細胞的視覺化作品之一

So, that was really cool to hear as well."

所以，聽到這真的很酷。」

"When you get a script,

「當你拿到一份腳本

do you make a storyboard or not?"

你會做個記事板演嗎？」

"I guess it depends on the method

「我猜這取決於

that we use to produce the piece because, for example,

我們用來產生作品 的方法，因為，比如說

things that would definitely be character-heavy,

有些角色較重的東西

like 'Ladder of Inference',

像「推論的梯子」（譯註：《Rethinking thinking》）

we worked with a storyboard from beginning to end

從頭到尾我們 都在記事板上操作

because we were dealing with character animation.

因為我們要處理角色動畫

And something like that is much different

類似這樣的東西是與，好比說吧

than stop-motion, for example.

是比靜態動作來說有很大的不同的

But, also, I mean Biljana and I have also worked together

但同時呢，我的意思是，Biljana 和我

for, like, nearly ten years or something absurd

在最近十年中也一起 做過許多荒謬的作品

so we don't need as much of a, you know,

所以你知道的，我們不需要太多的

a piece of paper to tell us what to do,

一張紙，來告訴我們該做什麼

whereas, if I were working with someone new,

而如果我正在 做一件新的東西的話

then I would really want to work with a storyboard,

我會真的很想用記事板來做

but we kind of trust each other."

但我們很信任彼此。」

"So, you, like, finish...

「所以，你們，就好像可以，完成...

...each other's sentences."

...對方的句子。」

"We can try that again."

「我們可以試試。」

"No, we definitely shouldn't use that, it's too cheesy."

「不，我們絕對不能用那個，太俗氣啦。」

"So, there was a part in the video

「所以，在影片中，有一部分

where we had to represent how the cells reproduce

我們不得不呈現細胞如何再製

and how chemotherapy affects it.

和化療如何影響它的過程

And it became quite complicated for me to visualize,

而且對我來說，將它視覺化變得相當複雜

so I actually had to ask you

所以我實際上不得不要你

to draw little doodles for me to actually explain that.

為我畫小小的塗鴉，來解釋那個部份

How was that for you?

你覺得那如何？

How was that experience?"

那是怎樣的經驗？」

"I mean, it was pretty difficult for me to visualize, too,

「我覺得...我也覺得很難去將它視覺化

so, it was interesting.

所以那很有趣

Doing the storyboard actually helped me clarify

實際上，記事板的確可以幫助我搞清楚

in my head, like, how it actually works

像我的腦袋一樣 它的運作方法

because when you have to explain something

因為當你要向其他人

to someone else, with anything, obviously,

解釋任何事的時候，很明顯地

you have to, like, really figure it out yourself.

你必須得自己真正去搞清楚

And, then, when you have to draw it,

然後，當你要畫出來時

that requires you to take an extra level

這要求你必須更進一步的

of abstraction and figure out,

理解這些抽象的概念

like, okay, like, what are the parts of this drawing

比如，嗯，圖畫的哪一部分

that are really important?

是真的很重要的？

What do I have to show clearly,

什麼是我必須清楚呈現出來的？

and how do I show it?

以及，我該如何呈現它？

And, so, doing that on a legal pad,

因此，在做好在成品時

which is, I think, how I ended up sending it to you guys,

也就是，我想，當我把完稿回傳你們那兒時

taking a picture of myself on camera,

我最終是如何把自己拍進照片裡

really helped, you know, me understand the crucial,

其實，你知道的，真的還幫助蠻大的 我理解那是重要的部份

and that's the crucial part

這就是為什麼

of why chemotherapy actually works.

化療作為真實工作的關鍵部分

So, it was a really interesting experience."

所以，那真是很有趣的經驗。」

"Yeah, we actually started that on a,

「是的，我們實際上是從那開始的

we had a whiteboard,

我們有個白板

and I was trying to figure out that process.

我也試圖理清創思的過程

I think we started at the beginning

我覺得我們從一開始時

from cell division and multiplying

從細胞分裂和增生

and, you know, chemotherapy working.

而且，你知道，化療工作

But then it became so crazy

但它變得瘋狂到

that I had to pull back and start from the end

我反而不得不從結尾開始

and go in a different direction.

並從不同的方向延伸

So, that became quite a challenge, too,

所以，那也成了要弄清楚它的

figuring it out."

一個大挑戰。」

"We ended up using the visual that you gave us on the storyboard,

「我們最終用了你給了我們 在分鏡腳本時所用的視覺效果

which is really cool to have that sort of collaboration

有這種和教育者一同工作的經驗

with the educator with whom you're working."

真的很酷。」

"And I can't draw, so that should be noted.

「而且我不會畫畫，請記得

It was a very rough storyboard."

它是個非常粗糙的分鏡腳本。」

"It was good enough."

「它夠好了。」

"Good enough!"

「足夠好了！」