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Good morning, ladies and gentlemen.
It's an honor to be here.
Thank you for having me at Google Hong Kong.
I hope today through this session
both parties can have a blast.
And at any time if you feel that you want to voice out or ask
questions, please feel free.
So when I first got the invitation
to come to Google Hong Kong, I was thinking to myself,
what the hell am I going to do at Google?
Because you guys are the people I go to when I look at my stuff.
It could be through the search engine.
It could be through maps.
I like to travel a lot.
I could throw on a backpack and just wander off somewhere into the world and see the world.
So I'm always navigating through maps.
And lately, actually, speaking of which,I've been trying to pick up on more Japanese.
So I do this a lot now every day.
I've been trying to pick up on more Japanese.
So lately I've made Google Translate my best friend.
So I've even...
I'm even forcing my smartphone to converse
in Japanese with me, because we only have 24 hours a day.
But I must say, sometimes the translations
are still a bit funky.
But 80% of the time it does the job very well.
So thank you for whoever out there that's
making my life a lot easier.
I do visit you guys very, very often every day.
But I'm not here to talk about what we can Google.
I think you guys out of everybody
knows best what we can search on the internet.
But maybe today we could touch on some other keywords where we
cannot fully understand through the internet.
Maybe keywords like creativity.
I think creativity for me, it's the biggest thing.
Either it be through my music, or my food shows, or movies,
or my business.
Because I think without creativity we cannot really
ensure our place in the market.
And eventually you will be left behind in the world.
Creativity comes in many different forms and styles,
It doesn't have to be through movies
or that kind of artistry.
It could be through tennis.
It could be through agriculture, architecture, woodworking,
lecturing, whatever it may be.
It could be through programming or engineering.
I think if Google was not as creative when they were doing the algorithms back then,
it would not be what it is today.
So a lot of people would say, yeah,
I'm not the creative type.
We all are.
We just have to find that one edge.
We have to find how we can synergize and capitalize
on that on our own strengths.
But it is getting harder and harder to be creative,
I think, in this world, because everyday we
are flooded by so much content in our phones.
All the blogs that we look at, all the comments,
all the likes, all the streaming, all the films.
But unknowingly, unknowingly we are so almost
too inspired to a point where we are losing ourselves,
because we are taking in everybody else's ideas--
their thoughts, their voices.
Therefore, if we are not creative enough,
we tend to what we call--
we would ride on other people's ideas.
Let's-- in Cantonese we would say...
But when we get into a habit of that,
we forget about being original, being really creative,
starting our own ideas.
And to me that is very, very dangerous, because if what
you put out is no different than the person next to you,
if what you contribute to the company
is just the same as everybody else in the room,
let me tell you something.
Next year you won't be here.
The company doesn't need you.
Eventually the market doesn't need you.
And the world-- they don't need you.
So constantly ask yourself how you
can contribute more than the person next to you.
I've been in my industry for more than 22 years now.
And I tell you, I ask myself that question every damn day.
Through music, through film, through my shows,
through my business.
How do I be more creative?
That is very, very hard.
And maybe even in some fields, it's getting harder and harder.
Like in music, I would say that it is harder for me
now to compose a very good piece of music
than it was 15, 20 years ago, because the time
signatures or the combinations of the notes
are simply being taken up.
It is harder to write something original than now
and have it not sound like that it has been written by someone,
sometime, like some song back then.
Because it's been done.
But in our world, that's what is happening
is because all the ideas are being voiced up.
And we are seeing it.
So if we don't voice out loud enough, clear enough,
soon enough, we are actually behind.
So I urge you--
the first key word that I would want to touch on
is actually creativity.
Does anybody have anything to say?
Any other things that you want to talk about?
Another word I would say is--
a keyword for me is experience, especially--
well, experience in terms of the verb experience, not the noun
experience, especially for you lot
where your work requires you to sit
behind a desk and a computer the whole day, maybe
the whole year.
But I would say that it is very important
to get out there to the world and really experience it.
Because I think the phone still only brings you halfway.
And you must walk the other half.
You know, nowadays when I'm chatting
with a lot of the younger generation kids, what really
happens a lot is that maybe the topic would
be along the line of, man, I was in--
I was-- I was in Finland last weekend.
The Aurora lights, they were beautiful.
And then the kid would say something like, yeah.
I saw it on YouTube.
Or yeah, yeah.
That was really cool.
I saw it on Facebook.
I'm sure it's an opening.
It's an idea.
It's a glimpse of what it really is.
But if that's how you see things,
you don't know...
Again, it's a great entrance to the world.
But it's halfway.
Please, when the opportunity allows, get off your butt
and walk the other half, which may be even more important.
Experience the world.
The phone is awesome.
The net is awesome.
But that is halfway, halfway.
Is it too early for you guys, because you
guys look kind of stale.
James, maybe we could start with a more Q&A.
If anybody wants, please jump in.
One of the things that is on our minds
is also giving back about creativity,
it's about experience.
A lot of that is because we're sort
of going through life through a screen,
and we're not interacting much.
Here at Google we spent a lot of time thinking about what
we're doing for Hong Kong, how we're supporting non-profits,
how we're providing services for schools--
training kids that code, for example.
What advice do you have for us, and also for the broader
millennial crowd who is interested in doing something
for Hong Kong?
How to get started.
How to think about that.
And what approach to take.
I think keep doing what you're doing.
But we cannot lose the--
what we're trying to do is share, I think, in this era.
And of course, sharing comes in different forms also.
And that's what Chef Nic, the brand,
is trying to do is because I think even now,
when you see families going off to go out to dinners,
they're eating through looking through their--
looking through their phones the whole time.
Actually, that's losing the true essence
of why we are eating together.
And that's what we're trying to promote through the "Chef Nic"
show is 鋒味.
What is 鋒味 is to actually enjoy a meal together.
And that's why-- that's what cooking has also taught me.
is let me tell you.
I was in really, really bad terms with my parents
for the longest time.
I was in boarding school ever since I was 12.
And then at the age of 14, I was sent to Tokyo
to start training in music.
By 16, I started working.
And I never really got a chance to have
a relationship with my parents.
And we've been on bad terms for the longest time,
until, until I started cooking.
Because when you cook, it's the food-- you don't eat it alone.
You want to share it.
You want to get some feedbacks.
And it gave me a medium to know how
to talk to my parents...
Whatever you cooked back then was really cool.
And you want to teach me?
It became-- now it's a habit, you know.
Does the food matter?
Of course it does.
But what really matters is how you find your way to share.
And I think keep doing what you're doing.
But if you can think of the third party,
then I think that the whole picture is much bigger.
Why don't you take a seat.
We'll chat a little bit and get comfortable.
It was very inspiring talk, hearing talk
about creativity and the journey where you just
mentioned how cooking brought you and your family closer
So a little bit on "Chef Nic."
It's now in its fifth season.
We're seeing a lot of traction both online and offline.
But I want to kind of turn back the clock back to 2014.
What besides what you just mentioned about the parents
thing-- but what was the thing that made you transition
from the singer, the actor to Chef Nic?
And what was that transition like?
I didn't think I--
I wasn't looking for a transition, really.
I thought I could do everything together.
I'm still doing music.
I'm still doing films.
It's weird, because people look at this
like I'm moving from woodworking to pharmacy.
It's not that far.
I think what I'm doing with food, with movies, and also
music, and the business together, I
think, as a whole it has perfect synergy.
I don't think that they're really unrelated.
And that's how I do things.
If I cannot pull resources from somewhere,
somehow to contribute into a new thing I do,
then I really would reconsider to either do it or not.
Because to start fresh at a later age-- later age--
is maybe at a disadvantage.
But first of all, I found food to be a true passion.
And then I also saw that it would be the next biggest thing
after communication and tech.
So I thought how I could kind of rejuvenate
the whole entertainment business of mine
and make it a long lasting one, I guess.
Was this interest in food something
that was always there?
It was always there.
But I thought to make it a bit more serious.
And at the time I think mainland China was actually--
it was really lacking a decent food or lifestyle show.
So we started 2014.
And we just finished the fifth season this year.
I've been watching.
So on the food topic, I'm sure you hear this a lot.
And even people who know me doing this have asked
this as well is that, you've never worked in the kitchen.
Can you really cook?
Like, obviously I heard stories.
And I know that you put a lot of hard work and dedication
and courage into being who you are today and achieving
what you've done.
But not everybody has seen that.
So what goes through your mind when
you hear criticism like this?
And how do you deal with?
It's logically acceptable.
Because first of all, we may think
that because someone has not been doing something for really
long, they can't be good at it.
That's the logic.
But that's almost like saying--
let put it this way.
That's almost like saying we as a human race,
we've been using the landline telephone for centuries.
Why don't we stick with it?
That must be the best way.
So dump all your iPhones.
Dump all your mobiles right now.
Let's go back to the landline, because we've been doing
that for the longest time.
That's like saying, we as a human race,
we've been using the--
we've been driving gasoline automobiles for centuries.
So has Elon Musk gone crazy to start Tesla?
Why are there so many electronic cars out there now?
Because that must be the best way,
because we've been doing it for the longest time.
I think we are that narrow-minded.
That really frightens me, because we are in a new era.
There are perks and different texts
now out there that allows us to pick up on information much
more rapidly than it has been in the traditional kitchen, I would say.
Oh, I'm sorry.
But the way I've heard is maybe the first apprentice cook
would be peeling vegetables for maybe a year or two.
But I have my ways, or I have saved up enough money
to be peeling something much more in the first year.
I mean, like we hear all these stories
about like, chefs training in Japan
and like they're washing rice for like seven years
before they can make sushi.
So is that the best and only way?
I don't think we can be that narrow-minded in thinking like that.
Of course, there has been a lot of hard work
and time and effort put into it.
But I don't have to get into those.
But how do you stay focused on doing what you need to do?
Do you have like a system?
Do you have a way to do things?
Because obviously it's a lot of work.
It's a lot of work.
There's a lot of learning involved.
Like, how do you stay organized?
How do you stay focused?
That's one thing I learned in the kitchen is
Because when you're trying to serve two dishes, it's easy.
For two, it's easy.
For four, it's OK.
For eight, yeah, it's not bad.
But when you try and do eight dishes for a table of 10,
and they all have to be hot when you serve like,
in Chinese food.
It's not that easy.
And when you do one of my Michelin galas,
when you're serving for 700, they still have to be hot.
And you've got eight minutes of serving time for 700 fine dining.
It's very hard.
But then you learn.
Gradually, eventually you learn how to pace ourselves.
And then your organization.
Like what I just demonstrated on my phone.
I try to squeeze in all these little seconds and milliseconds
in my life to gain just that much more.
But I guess when there's a will, there's a way.
I don't know your time schedules.
But you figure that out for yourself.
But there are these little gaps in life
where you can just squeeze in a bit more here
and there, knowledge.
And then eventually that adds up.
That adds up.
I think it's amazing how you're able to balance so many things
and do everything so well.
And I'm a very--
naturally I'm a very [SPEAKING CHINESE] person.
I'm a very--
I'm very curious about everything.
I mean, I look up stuff just to know, just to ask why, where,
And when I start something, I don't
like to stop until I actually get somewhere.
That's just a personality.
Yeah, I've heard many stories as well about--
--deep you go and how kind of focused you are,
and how deep down you drill into everything that you try to learn.
And I think that's something that's very admirable.
I can be a pain in the ass in that aspect.
But like I said, you're a man of many hats.
You're developing a chef career on the side.
You have music.
You have acting.
All that together.
Kind of bringing the conversation back
to where it started with music, your last Cantonese album
was in 2005.
One step closer.
And then your last Mandarin album
was 10 years ago.
It was 2009.
So I know you haven't stopped doing music.
So you've done movie songs, you did songs for your show.
And over the past 12 months, personally, I've
seen you kind of do a little bit more.
Started with 2018 [INAUDIBLE] in that performance.
You launched three singles this year.
You were a guest judge on "The Voice."
And now just recently you had the RTHK performance.
So is this foreshadowing something?
Are we going to see more music coming from you in 2019?
I didn't really plan this.
I think I'm just going with the flow, really.
But I think at different times with different inspirations,
or sometimes I feel that there are different advantages
for different fields.
You know how sometimes the stock market,
it's doing better than the real estate.
Sometimes music is doing better than film.
And that's how I can kind of weasel around and do my thing,
because there's never one trend that's always at the top.
That's actually true.
If you really look at the market,
something is always doing a bit better.
And if the trend is like that, and you kind of catch the wave,
man, you're on top.
Because when we started the "Chef Nic" show,
we are definitely the biggest food show in China.
When we started in 2014, by the third season
we were doing over 300 million RMB.
And now we're in the fifth season.
But if you catch the wave, that's a different thing.
That's a different thing.
So I think we're doing very stable in "Chef Nic."
So I think now I have the time to kind of--
Do more music.
--do more music.
So does that mean we'll see the album--
an album this year?
I don't know if I'm working on a full album.
But I don't really think if that really matters anymore
in the new market.
But what does matter?
I'm hoping for--
I'm actually working on a concert.
That's what we were going to ask.
In Hong Kong everybody
is starting a concert as if they have nothing else to do.
And still hard to buy tickets.
We need a bigger stadium.
That's what we need.
We need a bigger--
A new, bigger stadium.
We need more creativity.
Maybe that's why I couldn't book my stadium schedule, because I've been dissing it the whole time.
Well, time to get creative and think
about something different.
Back on the topic of [SPEAKING CHINESE], "The Voice."
A lot of people have said that this season was a lot better
than previous seasons.
I think so.
Personally, I think you being on it injected
kind of a different dynamic.
It was-- it was interesting to see how seriously you took it.
I heard a story that maybe I want
you to share with everybody about the drumming performance.
So I actually heard from Derek how hard you prepared for it
and how you kept on--
Well, preparation for the performance is a given.
But actually, when you talk about "The Voice," what I would
actually want to share is--
I don't know how many people has watched the show.
But you know how I got totally bashed
when I started hammering onto the button at first
in the first two episodes, because there are actually these two new perks.
They changed the way the game played this year.
That to start off with, all the contestants--
there are about 150 contestants put into one room.
And they are watching a live feed of whatever is happening on stage-- the performance, along with the judges' comments and how they would choose their team.
That's one thing.
The second thing is, each judge would have a six-person quota
to choose into assembling their team.
And if you do choose a seventh person,
that person would have to battle out any of their chosen--
the person from the original team.
So thinking like that, there are a few things
I tried doing is the first episode, if people
who have seen the show would see me just hearing the first two sentences, and then I would be smashing onto the button.
And then the reporters, the viewers,
who would say, he doesn't know Jack about music! Go back to cooking!
How could you choose someone from just listening
for the first two words?
What I found out was, I am very aware that for the past 10
years, like you said--
my last album was maybe 10 years ago--
I'm very aware that a lot of the younger kids,
they don't see me as a singer.
They don't see me as a musician.
If I were to fight for these contestants over--
with the other judges, I would have a very big disadvantage.
The only way I could plant some ideas into the 150 contestants
that are watching the live feed is
by hammering onto that button and slowly turning around,
because therefore, I have the floor.
I have the power of speech. Because they didn't choose the person.
So actually I'm trying to voice out and tell
not the person on the stage, but the 150 in the room,
what I have done or what my views on music
is so that they would feel more comfortable joining my team.
But then, man, I got totally bashed by the media,
by everybody else.
Yeah, stop this guy, or he's crazy, or whatever.
And that's one thing I found that was really
helping me out strategically.
The second thing is people are also bashing me for--
I would choose a lot of contestants
because I was solely pressing onto the button.
But what I was also doing is, I found out
if you had to choose a seventh member,
and if your whole team was equally matched, six of them
were equally as good, it's very hard for a newcomer
to choose who they would like to battle.
But if you have two that are--
it's cruel to say this-- but, if you
have two that is obviously a bit weaker,
it's easier for the newcomer to choose from.
So you could always keep on upgrading your team,
if that makes sense to anybody.
But strategically, I think I've done something new in the show.
So it seems like you took a very strategic approach
on how you picked your team and how you--
But at the end, I hope all these elements
would bring a better show.
So how long was the filming of the entire process?
The shooting days was 29 days.
But the whole process with all the rehearsal
and all the training was maybe three months.
So over that span, like being on "The Voice"
and this is a relatively new experience for you.
What do you think was the biggest thing that you
learned or gained from that?
For me, it was a great platform
to get back into music, because it
has the most reach right now in terms of variety shows in China.
Are you going back next season?
I don't know.
I don't know.
But some stuff like that, like kind of music shows and stuff
are still something you'd like to be more involved in?
As I talked about at the beginning of the talk,
you're the first guest we're having here at Talks at Google in Hong Kong.
So I'd be remiss not to bring the conversation back to tech a little bit.
I heard that you're a very heavy YouTube user.
So let's start from there.
You told me in the room.
So what's your view on kind of technology
and how we interact with platforms like YouTube and other social media?
And how do you think that plays into today's world, and even your own life and career?
Well, definitely for me it's a very important part of my life now.
I think for any of us, really.
We've just got gotten into the habit of learning a lot.
Even like, my kids, they're always on YouTube.
I think the tech nowadays, it has really enhanced the speed of our learning curve.
We are picking up the goods and bads through the internet.
Like, even through food
like how tech has really changed food immensely through the past 10 years now.
The delivery system has allowed us
to choose fresh goods from the internet, stuff like that.
You're not a very heavy user on social media.
I'm not a social media guy.
But if there's a destination I'm looking for,
then I would definitely go on it.
Do you feel that social media nowadays has kind of become something that
more or less kind of consumes people and has become more of an addiction for some people and...
takes away from the benefits of technology?
But then I think it's
a balance between for everything that we do.
If we go to extreme, it's always kind of harmful.
So we just have to balance it out.
Is that why you're not on it?
Or you just don't like it?
I'm just not in the habit of doing the...
that maybe it's just not me.
I think it's also a platform for you to kind share your views sure
and share what you've done and something like that.
So maybe something to consider.
Of course. Of course.
I'm sure if you opened up a YouTube channel
and shared your cooking tips,
everyone here would be love to subscribe.
But then that's another thing
right now that's really-- there's a bit of a language barrier.
I mean, I have a lot of clips, but they're in Mandarin.
So if I do put it on YouTube,
then I would have to kind of redo the exact same thing,
but one maybe in English or in Cantonese.
That really pisses me off.
I have to do three of the same thing.
I would have to kill three fish to do a steam fish.
And if you only kill one fish, people will be commenting again and saying
there's already a cut there.
OK, I've been meaning to ask you about a show
that you did called "Celebrity Chef East Versus West."
So you faced off against star chef David Rocco.
And it was a five episodes mini-series.
And spoiler alert-- you won.
Why did you choose to go film an English show?
What was that experience like?
Well, back to the part where a lot of people
has been doubting me for the cooking part.
So all you could do really is just
to go the extent to prove yourselves.
I think that in--
I've been doing that in every field, really.
That's why I put myself through competitions.
Especially when you do a foreign show like from Fox.
Then it's not a "Chef Nic" show.
That if I can't prove myself through that kind of platform,
then the haters will be haters.
But at least I've gone the extent.
I might even be going back this year
to be judging or even competing.
I'm OK with competing.
I think you just have to find yourself to--
find ways to prove yourself.
I have done many crazy stuff just to prove myself.
But sometimes that's the extent you would have to do.
I've jumped off buildings.
I've jumped off convention center in Hong Kong
When people also thought that I-- because I'm the son of two celebrities-- maybe
I don't take my job seriously.
And that's-- that's why I've been putting myself through all
this hardship and this pain and buildings after buildings,
because if that's not serious enough for you, then what is?
It may be silly to some people.
But then you go try it.
I mean, I'm sure in the room not everybody
is familiar with how you started and everything.
But definitely as someone who grew up in that generation,
I was able to witness all the negative--
But I was-- yeah.
For people who doesn't know,
the first four years of my career was 99% booing.
I would not get any applause anywhere.
The minute I stepped onstage it was all boos and foul language and profanities.
And it wasn't because of what you did.
It was because of your background and who you were.
And it was really, really tough for four years.
Every time I walked off stage I would see my managers and my team.
They would be just...
they would be all holding their fist and just crying.
And I would be the only one that could walk back to the changing room
and cool myself down.
But I would have to endure that for every day for four years.
And you kept going.
Because back then we had so much promotion to do, all the performances.
Back then it was work after work.
And because there was no internet yet.
So everything was live.
Every day was live.
Every time before I walked on stage,
I would almost get paranoid about being booed.
Because it got to an extent where
I could not hear one word of the song I was singing.
It was getting that nasty.
Then somewhere in year 2000, it turned around.
What was the turning point?
I don't know, man.
You don't know.
Maybe, maybe there was some new kid to pick on.
Or maybe they just got tired of all the hating.
Or maybe they saw...
Or maybe there was enough buildings jumped.
But what I mean is...
You didn't jump the convention in 2000.
No, I didn't.
I jumped it in a 2003 or somewhere like that with Mr. Jackie Chan.
When there is that need, you just
have to find your way to excel.
Maybe there are some crazy things that we've got to do.
Thank you for that.
Any live questions?
So during the first few years
when things were really tough, did you ever doubt yourself
and think that you just weren't good enough?
And if you did, what kept you going?
But maybe for a very short time.
I never doubted myself in terms of music.
I never doubted myself in terms of all the hard work
I was putting in.
I believe in...
I think I'm a logical person.
And I think anybody can accomplish anything if you work hard enough.
Really, I don't think there was a time where
I think I could have given up.
I would just-- I'm the person that does not give up.
Naturally, I just have that kind of personality.
And the second thing is, I can't give up,
because I had to make a living.
A lot of people would imagine that because I came from a family of two actors and actresses...
an actress-- that I don't take my job seriously.
But I've been self-sustained ever since my debut.
At the age of 20 I'd been paying my sister's education.
So that's behind the scenes stories.
But I could not afford to give up my job back then.
So I took everything more seriously than anybody would have ever thought.
I have a question online.
Do you think though you've been in, like I said, over 50 films.
I didn't know that.
I looked that up.
What's your outlook on the genre of [SPEAKING CHINESE]??
Do you think there's a future?
What do you think the future looks like?
Back to the creativity thing.
I think we are--
Hong Kong right now is-- we are really lacking this part.
I think we have been geniuses in the stock market.
We are excellent in the real estate market.
But maybe that's the last generation, the past generations.
To get by in this generation we've
got to be really creative in our own fields.
Like in movies.
If you're talking about the movie industry.
I think we've all had our fair shares of the Marvel DC franchises
where we've all seen our Supermans, our Batmans,
our Ironmans, our Hulks, our Flashes, our Wonder Womans, our...
I can go on and on.
And we have all seen them.
The thing is, don't we have 5,000 years of history and culture?
But yet we are still shooting the monkey king.
So I urge any of you guys out there,
if you guys ever fantasize about our own superheroes,
please jot down something.
Write a paragraph or two.
Send them to me or to whoever that you think can make something happen.
Because we have to.
If we don't, we're going to be really, really behind really, really far.
Send in your movie idea to me.
I'll pass them along.
The next live question.
The question I want to ask is,
can you share with us one of the failure story,
or the moment you doubt yourself-- is a good decision to kick off this "Chef Nic" show?
And then if that is yes, how you overcome?
How you self-motivate yourself and then bring back your passion.
Many failures, really.
But I think in business I would say
one of the more obvious ones were I invested
in a company that did a post-production
at the age of 22, 23.
That was 2003.
I started a post company--
And we would do computer graphics.
We would do color grading.
We would do editing.
Dubbing for a lot of commercials and films and stuff like that.
So when you're in that kind of a hardware tech company,
you buy a lot of stuff.
You buy a lot of--
we call [INAUDIBLE],, editors, and mics, and this and that.
But back then we were at the end of the analog trend.
And all of a sudden things changed.
They don't use tapes anymore.
They went from analog to digital.
But all my hardware, they were a lot of money.
So all those all of a sudden went into the can.
And that's-- to the well where I was just saying,
if you can catch the trend, that's a different story.
I didn't back then.
And I lost I lost a lot of money back then.
I had to mortgage my house and all that.
But that was on me.
You know, everything just changed.
But do I-- at that time it was hard.
But I still believed in the network that I had built,
all the connections, and the work we were doing.
And then at the end we were OK.
But there were a few years that was really, really tough.
But as long as-- you have to stick with it.
I mean, a lot of stuff I do, it doesn't reflect right away.
Most of the stuff doesn't reflect right away.
The "Chef Nic" show didn't reflect right away.
But eventually, eventually.
Like how everybody would doubt me through my--
in my culinary journey.
But then last month, or two months just now,
I think maybe a lot of people had also had the "Chef Nic"
It was really good.
At that price I think we did a great job.
And you know, actually, right after this meeting
I'm going into inventing-- into the Central Kitchen
to invent the 2019 one again.
And we sold within five weeks-- just only in Hong Kong--
we sold over 2 million burgers.
And there is only, let me remind you,
only 6 point somewhat million population in Hong Kong.
I ate like, five.
I thank you.
But then, yes.
It took five years to kind of prove yourself.
Just you really have to stick with it.
On the-- just a quick question also
online on the McDonald's collaboration.
Throughout the whole process, how many burgers
did you have to eat?
Man, I ate--
I ate a lot of burgers.
And there are--
I ate a lot of burgers.
We also tested a lot of the fries, a lot of the ice cream,
a lot of drinks.
There were a lot of other crazy stuff that we tested.
What's that creative process working
to create a new menu item?