【TED】簡-古道爾。我們與黑猩猩的區別是什麼？(What separates us from chimpanzees? | Jane Goodall) (【TED】Jane Goodall: What separates us from chimpanzees? (What separates us from chimpanzees?

字幕列表影片播放

Good morning everyone. First of all, it's been fantastic

譯者: Zhang Jing 審譯者: Adrienne Lin
being here over these past few days.

各位早上好。首先，我感覺，太棒了
And secondly, I feel it's a great honor to kind of wind up

這幾天在這太棒了。
this extraordinary gathering of people,

其次，我覺得能夠最後出場是我莫大的榮幸
these amazing talks that we've had.

面對這麼一群了不起的人
I feel that I've fitted in, in many ways,

他們剛才的演講非常精彩。
to some of the things that I've heard.

我發現，在很多方面
I came directly here

我很贊同我所聽到的一些事情。
from the deep, deep tropical rainforest in Ecuador,

我從厄瓜多最茂密的原始森林
where I was out -- you could only get there by a plane --

直接飛到了這裡。
with indigenous people with paint on their faces

我工作的地方-只有乘直升飛機可以到達-
and parrot feathers on their headdresses,

那裡的土著人臉上塗著染料
where these people are fighting to try and keep the oil companies,

戴著鸚鵡羽毛做成的頭飾。
and keep the roads, out of their forests.

在那裡，他們盡力阻止石油公司進入森林，
They're fighting to develop their own way of living within the forest

不讓他們在森林裡鋪路。
in a world that's clean, a world that isn't contaminated,

他們在鬥爭，竭力在維持他們自己的生活方式
a world that isn't polluted.

維持一種潔淨、沒有被污染，
And what was so amazing to me, and what fits right in

沒有被毒害的環境。
with what we're all talking about here at TED,

我感到很神奇的是，這一點
is that there, right in the middle of this rainforest,

恰好與TED的話題相一致，
was some solar panels -- the first in that part of Ecuador --

在那裡，就在熱帶雨林的正中央，
and that was mainly to bring water up by pump

有一些太陽能設備-是厄瓜多那一地區最早的-
so that the women wouldn't have to go down.

主要用來抽水
The water was cleaned, but because they got a lot of batteries,

這樣婦女們就不用下山挑水。
they were able to store a lot of electricity.

那裡的水是很乾淨的，因為他們發到了很多電，
So every house -- and there were, I think, eight houses

他們就能夠存儲這些電。
in this little community -- could have light

所以每一家-我記得那裡有8戶人家
for, I think it was about half an hour each evening.

在這個小社區裏面，能夠用上電燈
And there is the Chief, in all his regal finery, with a laptop computer.

我覺得每天晚上大概可以維持半個小時。
(Laughter)

他們的酋長，穿著土著的服裝，卻有一台筆記型電腦。
And this man, he has been outside, but he's gone back,

（笑）
and he was saying, "You know, we have suddenly jumped into

這個人，曾經離開村莊，最終他又回來，
a whole new era, and we didn't even know about the white man

他說，“你看，我們一下子跳到了
50 years ago, and now here we are with laptop computers,

一個新的時代，50年前，我們甚至不知道有白種人，
and there are some things we want to learn from the modern world.

現在我們卻用著筆記本電腦，
We want to know about health care.

我們想向現代社會學習很多東西。
We want to know about what other people do -- we're interested in it.

我們想瞭解醫療保健。
And we want to learn other languages.

我們想知道其他地方的人在做什麽-我們確實很好奇。
We want to know English and French and perhaps Chinese,

我們也想學別國的語言。
and we're good at languages."

我們想學習英語、法語、或許還可以學中文，
So there he is with his little laptop computer,

我們很擅長學習語言。“
but fighting against the might of the pressures --

他用著小小的筆記型電腦，
because of the debt, the foreign debt of Ecuador --

對抗著來自外界強大的壓力
fighting the pressure of World Bank, IMF, and of course

這些壓力主要來自厄瓜多大量的國外貸款-
the people who want to exploit the forests and take out the oil.

需要對抗來自世界銀行，貨幣基金組織的壓力
And so, coming directly from there to here.

同樣需要對抗那些想要破壞森林開採石油的人。
But, of course, my real field of expertise

所以，我從那裡直接飛到了這裡。
lies in an even different kind of civilization --

當然，我真正的專業
I can't really call it a civilization.

是研究另外一個物種的文明-
A different way of life, a different being.

我甚至不能將其稱為一種”文明“
We've talked earlier -- this wonderful talk by Wade Davis

是另一種生活方式，另一種生物。
about the different cultures of the humans around the world --

我們之前討論過-韋德戴衛斯之前做過的演講
but the world is not composed only of human beings;

關於世界各個地區人們的文化
there are also other animal beings.

但是這個世界不僅僅有我們人類組成，
And I propose to bring into this TED conference,

還有其他動物的存在。
as I always do around the world, the voice of the animal kingdom.

我想要帶給TED大會，
Too often we just see a few slides, or a bit of film,

正向我在世界上其他地方做的那樣，來自動物的聲音。
but these beings have voices that mean something.

通常我們只能看到一些照片，或者電影片段，
And so, I want to give you a greeting,

但是這些動物有著代表特定意思的聲音。
as from a chimpanzee in the forests of Tanzania --

所以，我想帶給你們
Ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh!

來自坦桑尼亞森林中黑猩猩的問候
(Applause)

噢-- 噢-- ，噢，噢，噢！
I've been studying chimpanzees in Tanzania since 1960.

（掌聲）
During that time, there have been modern technologies

我從1960年就開始在坦桑尼亞研究黑猩猩。
that have really transformed the way

那時，也有一些現代技術
that field biologists do their work.

這些技術深刻改變了
For example, for the first time, a few years ago,

野外生物學家做研究的方式。
by simply collecting little fecal samples

例如，許多年前，
we were able to have them analyzed -- to have DNA profiling done --

我們第一次實現了僅僅從動物排泄物
so for the first time, we actually know which male chimps

來分析它們的DNA序列-
are the fathers of each individual infant.

我們第一次能夠確定哪隻雄性黑猩猩
Because the chimps have a very promiscuous mating society.

是某隻剛出生的黑猩猩的父親。
So this opens up a whole new avenue of research.

因為黑猩猩的交配情況很複雜。
And we use GSI -- geographic whatever it is, GSI --

這給黑猩猩研究開闢了一個新的時代。
to determine the range of the chimps.

然後我們採用地面速度指示器-
And we're using -- you can see that I'm not really into this kind of stuff --

來確定黑猩猩的活動範圍。
but we're using satellite imagery

我們正在使用- 我對這些東西並不是非常在行-
to look at the deforestation in the area.

我們正在使用衛星成像技術
And of course, there's developments in infrared,

來檢測這一地區的森林砍伐情況。
so you can watch animals at night,

當然，紅外線技術也在進步，
and equipment for recording by video,

我們可以夜間觀察這些動物，
and tape recording is getting lighter and better.

記錄畫面的攝影設備、
So in many, many ways, we can do things today

錄音設備等變得更輕更好。
that we couldn't do when I began in 1960.

所以，今天，我們能夠做很多，
Especially when chimpanzees, and other animals

1960年所不能夠實現的東西。
with large brains, are studied in captivity,

尤其是黑猩猩，或者其他
modern technology is helping us to search

那些腦容量較大的動物，
for the upper levels of cognition in some of these non-human animals.

當你在籠子裡觀察它們時，現代科技在
So that we know today, they're capable of performances

用來研究這些動物的高層次認知等能力上，非常有幫助。
that would have been thought absolutely impossible

現在我們知道，它們有能力完成一些
by science when I began.

在我剛開始做研究時認為
I think the chimpanzee in captivity who is the most skilled

完全不可能的任務。
in intellectual performance is one called Ai in Japan --

我認為世界上人工飼養最聰明的黑猩猩
her name means love --

是來自日本的“艾”
and she has a wonderfully sensitive partner working with her.

她名字的意思是愛
She loves her computer --

她有一個非常敏銳的“夥伴”
she'll leave her big group, and her running water,

她愛她的電腦
and her trees and everything.

甚至會離開它的同伴、水源，
And she'll come in to sit at this computer --

森林和其他所有的東西。
it's like a video game for a kid; she's hooked.

來坐在這台電腦跟前
She's 28, by the way, and she does things with her computer screen

就像小孩喜歡電腦遊戲，她也上癮了。
and a touch pad that she can do faster than most humans.

順帶一提，她已經28歲了，她用電腦螢幕和
She does very complex tasks, and I haven't got time to go into them,

一個觸摸板來操作，速度能超過大部份人。
but the amazing thing about this female is

她能夠完成很複雜的任務 -- 今天沒有時間詳談，
she doesn't like making mistakes.

但是這隻黑猩猩最神奇的地方在於
If she has a bad run, and her score isn't good,

她不喜歡犯錯。
she'll come and reach up and tap on the glass --

當她任務完成了不好，得分很低時，
because she can't see the experimenter --

她就會走過來，拍玻璃
which is asking to have another go.

因為她看不到實驗觀察者
And her concentration -- she's already concentrated hard

意思就是想要再做一遍。
for 20 minutes or so, and now she wants to do it all over again,

她的注意力呢，能夠非常專心
just for the satisfaction of having done it better.

長達20分鐘，她會希望重新再做一遍，
And the food is not important -- she does get a tiny reward,

就是爲了能夠做的更好，得到這種滿足感。
like one raisin for a correct response --

食物對她來說並不重要，她的獎勵是非常微薄的，
but she will do it for nothing, if you tell her beforehand.

例如每當她做出正確反應時，會得到個葡萄乾
So here we are, a chimpanzee using a computer.

如果你提前告訴她不會得到什麽獎勵的話，她仍然會去做。
Chimpanzees, gorillas, orangutans also learn human sign language.

所以我們就看到了，一隻操作電腦的黑猩猩。
But the point is that when I was first in Gombe in 1960 --

黑猩猩、大猩猩和猩猩都能夠學習人類的手勢語。
I remember so well, so vividly, as though it was yesterday --

關鍵是，當我1960年第一次到貢貝(奈及利亞)
the first time, when I was going through the vegetation,

我記得非常清楚，就像昨天才發生
the chimpanzees were still running away from me, for the most part,

當我第一次穿行在灌木叢中，
although some were a little bit acclimatized --

黑猩猩在大多數時候還是會嚇得跑開，
and I saw this dark shape, hunched over a termite mound,

或許它們還不適應變化了的環境
and I peered with my binoculars.

我看到一個黑色的影子，彎腰朝著一個白蟻丘，
It was, fortunately, one adult male whom I'd named David Greybeard --

我用望遠鏡遠遠觀察著。
and by the way, science at that time was telling me that I shouldn't name the chimps;

很幸運地是，我觀察到一隻雄性黑猩猩，我叫他大偉老頭
they should all have numbers; that was more scientific.

其實，那時候科學上，我不該給黑猩猩起名字，
Anyway, David Greybeard -- and I saw that

而是應該統一編號，那樣更加科學一些。
he was picking little pieces of grass and using them

回到大偉老頭-我看見
to fish termites from their underground nest.

他撿了一根草，用它
And not only that -- he would sometimes pick a leafy twig

把那些白蟻從地下洞穴中引出來。
and strip the leaves --

不僅如此，有時候他還會折一根有葉子的樹枝
modifying an object to make it suitable for a specific purpose --

然後去掉葉子來“釣”白蟻。
the beginning of tool-making.

改變物品，使之更適合某種特殊用途
The reason this was so exciting and such a breakthrough

也就是製作工具的開端呀。
is at that time, it was thought that humans,

這個發現讓我非常激動的原因，
and only humans, used and made tools.

是在那個時候，這是一個突破，那時認為人類，
When I was at school, we were defined as man, the toolmaker.

且只有人類，會製造和使用工具。
So that when Louis Leakey, my mentor, heard this news,

我以前唸書，人類被定義為會製作工具的。
he said, "Ah, we must now redefine 'man,' redefine 'tool,'

所以當我的導師，路易斯利基，聽說了我的發現以後，
or accept chimpanzees as humans."

他說：“啊，現在我們得重新定義人類，重新定義工具了，
(Laughter)

要不然就接受"黑猩猩也是人"為事實。“
We now know that at Gombe alone, there are nine different ways

（笑）
in which chimpanzees use different objects for different purposes.

我們現在瞭解到僅僅在貢貝，
Moreover, we know that in different parts of Africa,

就發現了黑猩猩可以用九種不同的方式來使用工具達到特定目的。
wherever chimps have been studied,

此外，我們知道在非洲許多地區，
there are completely different tool-using behaviors.

只要研究過那裡的黑猩猩，
And because it seems that these patterns are passed

就會發現完全不同的實用工具的行為。
from one generation to the next, through observation,

因為似乎這些行為是
imitation and practice -- that is a definition of human culture.

一代一代傳下來的，
What we find is that over these 40-odd years

通過觀察、模仿和練習學會的。也就是人類文化的定義。
that I and others have been studying chimpanzees

在過去四十多年里
and the other great apes, and, as I say, other mammals

我和其他研究黑猩猩
with complex brains and social systems,

研究類人猿，或者說研究其他
we have found that after all, there isn't a sharp line

具有複雜大腦和社會系統的哺乳動物的學者，
dividing humans from the rest of the animal kingdom.

我們發現，並沒有一條清晰的分界線
It's a very wuzzy line.

能夠把人類和其他動物區分開來。
It's getting wuzzier all the time as we find animals doing things

這條線非常彎曲。
that we, in our arrogance, used to think was just human.

每當我們發現動物能夠做
The chimps -- there's no time to discuss their fascinating lives --

那些我們自大認為，只有人類能做的事時，這條界線就越彎曲。
but they have this long childhood, five years

黑猩猩，我們沒有時間討論它們讓人著迷的生活
of suckling and sleeping with the mother,

有漫長的童年，它們有五年的時間
and then another three, four or five years

用來吃奶、與母親同睡，
of emotional dependence on her, even when the next child is born.

之後另外的三年、四年或者五年、
The importance of learning in that time, when behavior is flexible --

仍然從感情上依賴者母親，有時甚至直到下一代出生。
and there's an awful lot to learn in chimpanzee society.

這一段時間，學習對它們來說非常重要，因為這時行為是可塑的，
The long-term affectionate supportive bonds

在黑猩猩的社會裡，要學的東西非常多。
that develop throughout this long childhood with the mother,

這種長時間的情感支持聯繫
with the brothers and sisters,

這種聯繫是來自漫長童年期中與母親、
and which can last through a lifetime,

其他的兄弟姐妹逐漸形成的，
which may be up to 60 years.

能夠維持一生，
They can actually live longer than 60 in captivity,

有時會持續到60歲。
so we've only done 40 years in the wild so far.

人工飼養的黑猩猩可以活到60多歲，
And we find chimps are capable of true compassion and altruism.

而我們的研究只有40年。
We find in their non-verbal communication -- this is very rich --

我們發現黑猩猩有著真正的同情和利他能力。
they have a lot of sounds, which they use in different circumstances,

這一點我們是從他們的非語言交流中發現的，這種交流的內容非常豐富
but they also use touch, posture, gesture,

它們有很多種聲音，在不同的環境中使用不同的聲音，
and what do they do?

此外它們還用接觸、手勢、姿勢來交流
They kiss; they embrace; they hold hands.

它們到底會做什麽呢？
They pat one another on the back; they swagger; they shake their fist --

它們接吻、擁抱、握手。
the kind of things that we do,

它們會拍著另外一個同伴的背，它們會大搖大擺地走來走去，揮舞它們的拳頭
and they do them in the same kind of context.

它們會做這些我們通常做的動作
They have very sophisticated cooperation.

它們在相似的情景下也在做這些動作。
Sometimes they hunt -- not that often,

它們有著非常複雜的合作行為。
but when they hunt, they show sophisticated cooperation,

有時候它們也會打獵，雖然時候不多，
and they share the prey.

但是每當它們打獵時，就會表現出高超的合作，
We find that they show emotions, similar to -- maybe sometimes the same --

它們會分享獵物。
as those that we describe in ourselves as happiness, sadness, fear, despair.

我們發現它們會表露感情，這些感情與
They know mental as well as physical suffering.

我們用來描述高興、沮喪、害怕和絕望的詞有些類似，甚至是一樣。
And I don't have time to go into the information

它們懂得心理和身體的痛苦。
that will prove some of these things to you,

我也沒有時間來講那些
save to say that there are very bright students, in the best universities,

能夠證明我所說的例子，
studying emotions in animals, studying personalities in animals.

我打算把時間節省下來講一下有很多著名大學的優秀學生
We know that chimpanzees and some other creatures

在研究動物的情感和個性。
can recognize themselves in mirrors -- "self" as opposed to "other."

我們知道黑猩猩和其他一些動物
They have a sense of humor, and these are the kind of things

能夠認出鏡子中的自己，區分自己與他人。
which traditionally have been thought of as human prerogatives.

它們有幽默感，
But this teaches us a new respect -- and it's a new respect

而幽默感過去被認為只有人類才具有的。
not only for the chimpanzees, I suggest,

這教給我一種新的尊重，不僅僅是對
but some of the other amazing animals with whom we share this planet.

黑猩猩的尊重，我覺得，
Once we're prepared to admit that after all,

也是對與我們共住在地球上的其他神奇動物的尊重。
we're not the only beings with personalities, minds

一旦我們準備好承認這一點，
and above all feelings, and then we start to think

也就是我們不僅僅是唯一有個性、思想、
about ways we use and abuse

和以上提到的各種情緒感受的人，我們就會開始反思，
so many other sentient, sapient creatures on this planet,

那些我們利用、虐待
it really gives cause for deep shame, at least for me.

這個星球上那些感覺敏銳、聰明伶俐動物的行為，
So, the sad thing is that these chimpanzees --

我們會感到深深地羞愧，至少我是這樣。
who've perhaps taught us, more than any other creature, a little humility --

非常遺憾的是，這些黑猩猩，
are in the wild, disappearing very fast.

教會了我們如何謙虛的野生黑猩猩，
They're disappearing for the reasons

正在迅速地消失。
that all of you in this room know only too well.

它們消失的原因，
The deforestation, the growth of human populations, needing more land.

相信在座的人都非常清楚。
They're disappearing because some timber companies

人口增加需要開墾更多土地，砍伐更多樹木。
go in with clear-cutting.

它們消失是因為很多伐木公司，
They're disappearing in the heart of their range in Africa

到森林裡砍盡了所有的樹木。
because the big multinational logging companies have come in and made roads --

它們從核心聚居地非洲消失了
as they want to do in Ecuador

因為大跨國伐木公司到了那裡，到處造路
and other parts where the forests remain untouched --

就像他們在厄瓜多所做的一樣，
to take out oil or timber.

以及在其他那些森林尚未砍伐的地方一樣，
And this has led in Congo basin, and other parts of the world,

去開採石油或者森林。
to what is known as the bush-meat trade.

這使得剛果盆地，以及世界上許多其他地方，
This means that although for hundreds, perhaps thousands of years,

出現了很多眾所周知的“野生肉”。
people have lived in those forests, or whatever habitat it is,

這意味著雖然在過去的幾百年、甚至幾千年，
in harmony with their world, just killing the animals they need

居住在森林中的人們，無論其習俗如何，
for themselves and their families --

都能夠與世界和諧相處，只獵殺足夠他們
now, suddenly, because of the roads,

自己和家人吃的動物肉。
the hunters can go in from the towns.

現在，突然間，因為有了道路，
They shoot everything, every single thing that moves

獵人可以從鎮上進入森林中。
that's bigger than a small rat; they sun-dry it or smoke it.

他們朝著所有的動物開槍，只要是會動的
And now they've got transport; they take it on the logging trucks

比小老鼠大一點點的動物他們都獵殺，之後風乾或火烤。
or the mining trucks into the towns where they sell it.

現在有了交通工具，他們把這些動物裝到運木材的卡車上
And people will pay more for bush-meat, as it's called,

或是裝礦石的車上，運到鎮上去賣掉這些動物。
than for domestic meat -- it's culturally preferred.

人們會付比買飼養的動物更多的錢，來買野生肉，
And it's not sustainable, and the huge logging camps in the forest

因為他們較喜歡這種肉。
are now demanding meat, so the Pygmy hunters in the Congo basin

但這不是永續的行為，森林裡的大型伐木公司
who've lived there with their wonderful way of living

要求肉類食物，因此，剛果盆地的匹格米獵人，
for so many hundreds of years are now corrupted.

這些人數百年來的生活方式
They're given weapons; they shoot for the logging camps; they get money.

現在都走樣了。
Their culture is being destroyed,

他們有武器，為伐木公司打獵，伐木公司付他們錢。
along with the animals upon whom they depend.

他們的文化已經遭到了破壞，
So, when the logging camp moves, there's nothing left.

他們賴以生存的動物也面臨滅絕。
We talked already about the loss of human cultural diversity,

當伐木公司搬走之後，所有東西都失去了。
and I've seen it happening with my own eyes.

我們之前談到過人類文化多樣性的喪失，
And the grim picture in Africa -- I love Africa,

我親眼見到了。
and what do we see in Africa?

非洲現在的現實非常殘酷，我熱愛非洲，
We see deforestation;

我們在非洲看到了什麽呢？
we see the desert spreading; we see massive hunger;

我們看到森林砍伐，
we see disease and we see population growth in areas

看到沙漠擴張、大範圍的飢餓情況
where there are more people living on a certain piece of land

我們看到了疾病、人口的膨脹
than the land can possibly support,

在一塊地方居住的人們
and they're too poor to buy food from elsewhere.

超過了土地所能承受的能力，
Were the people that we heard about yesterday,

他們太窮了，從任何別的地方都買不起食物。
on the Easter Island, who cut down their last tree -- were they stupid?

我們昨天聽到的那些，
Didn't they know what was happening?

在復活節島上居住的人們，砍掉了最後一棵樹-他們笨嗎？
Of course, but if you've seen the crippling poverty

難道他們不知道當前的情形嗎？
in some of these parts of the world

他們當然知道，但當你看過拖垮一切的貧窮
it isn't a question of "Let's leave the tree for tomorrow."

在這些地區的樣貌
"How am I going to feed my family today?

“為未來保留樹木”對他們來說不會是選項。
Maybe I can get just a few dollars from this last tree

我今天如何餵飽我的家人?
which will keep us going a little bit longer,

或許我可以從最後那棵樹上得到幾美元
and then we'll pray that something will happen

能夠讓我們多活幾天，
to save us from the inevitable end."

然後祈禱會有一些改變
So, this is a pretty grim picture.

將我們從不可避免的毀滅中解救出來。“
The one thing we have, which makes us so different

所以，這幅景象非常淒慘。
from chimpanzees or other living creatures,

我們所擁有的，使我們區別於
is this sophisticated spoken language --

黑猩猩或者其他動物的是，
a language with which we can tell children

這種複雜的口語
about things that aren't here.

通過這種語言我們可以教我們的孩子
We can talk about the distant past, plan for the distant future,

那些不在眼前的事物。
discuss ideas with each other,

我們能討論過去的事情，也能計劃遙遠的未來，
so that the ideas can grow from the accumulated wisdom of a group.

彼此交流思想，
We can do it by talking to each other;

由此，群體裡積聚的智慧得以延伸、擴展。
we can do it through video; we can do it through the written word.

我們可以通過彼此交談獲得智慧，
And we are abusing this great power we have to be wise stewards,

我們可以通過影響、通過記錄的文字實現。
and we're destroying the world.

我們正在濫用這種應該得到謹慎使用的能力，
In the developed world, in a way, it's worse,

我們正在破壞世界。
because we have so much access to knowledge

在某種程度上，發達國家的情況更糟，
of the stupidity of what we're doing.

因為我們有更多機會去意識
Do you know, we're bringing little babies

我們正在做的事情的愚昧。
into a world where, in many places, the water is poisoning them?

你知道嗎？我們正在把小孩
And the air is harming them, and the food that's grown

帶到一個，水會毒害他們、
from the contaminated land is poisoning them.

空氣會傷害他們，莊稼長在
And that's not just in the far-away developing world; that's everywhere.

被污染了的土地上，長出的食物將會毒害他們。
Do you know we all have about 50 chemicals

這種現象不僅僅在遙遠的發展中國家，而是遍佈各地。
in our bodies we didn't have about 50 years ago?

你知道嗎？顯著我們體內有50種化學物質
And so many of these diseases, like asthma

爾這些物質在50年前是我們身體裏面沒有的？
and certain kinds of cancers, are on the increase

疾病中的許多種，例如哮喘
around places where our filthy toxic waste is dumped.

和某些特定癌癥的患病率在上升
We're harming ourselves around the world,

發生在那些亂扔有毒垃圾的地方。
as well as harming the animals, as well as harming nature herself --

世界各地的人都在毒害自己，
Mother Nature, that brought us into being;

傷害著動物，也傷害了自然界本身。
Mother Nature, where I believe we need to spend time,

大自然，孕育了我們。
where there's trees and flowers and birds

大自然，這個我們花時間的地方，
for our good psychological development.

那些花兒、鳥兒、樹木
And yet, there are hundreds and hundreds of children

對我們的心理健康發展都很有幫助。
in the developed world who never see nature,

然而，在發達國家，
because they're growing up in concrete

有成千的孩子從未見過大自然，
and all they know is virtual reality,

他們在水泥叢林中長大，
with no opportunity to go and lie in the sun,

他們僅僅知道虛擬世界，
or in the forest, with the dappled sun-specks

沒有機會走出房間，曬曬太陽，
coming down from the canopy above.

或者到森林裡，看看斑駁的樹影
As I was traveling around the world, you know,

從似穹窿的樹冠上灑下來。
I had to leave the forest -- that's where I love to be.

當我在世界各地旅遊時，
I had to leave these fascinating chimpanzees

我就得離開這些森林-我最喜歡待在那裡了。
for my students and field staff to continue studying

我不得不離開那些令人著迷的黑猩猩
because, finding they dwindled from about two million

留著讓我的學生和野外的同事繼續研究
100 years ago to about 150,000 now,

因為，當發現它們從100年前的兩百萬隻
I knew I had to leave the forest to do what I could

銳減到現在的十五萬隻，
to raise awareness around the world.

我明白我必須離開森林去做我力所能及的
And the more I talked about the chimpanzees' plight,

來提升全人類的意識。
the more I realized the fact that everything's interconnected,

我講述黑猩猩狀況的次數越多，
and the problems of the developing world

我就越會發現每件事都是內在關聯的，
so often stem from the greed of the developed world,

發展中國家的問題
and everything was joining together, and making -- not sense,

很多時候都起源於發達國家的貪婪，
hope lies in sense, you said -- it's making a nonsense.

當每件事情綜合到一起時，會產生——不是意義，
How can we do it?

我們希望它變得有意義——爾是荒唐。
Somebody said that yesterday.

我們如何改變這一點？
And as I was traveling around, I kept meeting young people who'd lost hope.

昨天有人說，
They were feeling despair,

每當我到處旅行時，我都會堅持與那些失去希望的年輕人見面。
they were feeling, "Well, it doesn't matter what we do;

他們感覺很絕望，
eat, drink and be merry, for tomorrow we die.

他們認為，”好吧，無論我們做什麽，
Everything is hopeless -- we're always being told so by the media."

吃、喝、結婚，早晚有一天還是要死的。
And then I met some who were angry,

每件事情都是沒有意義，我們通常從媒體上看到的都是這樣。”
and anger that can turn to violence,

有時我會碰到很生氣的人，
and we're all familiar with that.

這種憤怒會轉化為暴力，
And I have three little grandchildren,

我們對此都很熟悉。
and when some of these students would say to me

我有三個小孫子孫女，
at high school or university, they'd say, "We're angry,"

在高中或大學授課的時候
or "We're filled with despair, because we feel

有些學生會對我說，“我們很憤怒。”
you've compromised our future, and there's nothing we can do about it."

或者是“我們非常絕望，因為
And I looked in the eyes of my little grandchildren,

你們破壞了我們的前途，而我們又無能為力。”
and think how much we've harmed this planet since I was their age.

我看著我這些孫子，想著
I feel this deep shame, and that's why in 1991 in Tanzania,

自從我還是他們年紀到現在，我們對地球造成了多少傷害。
I started a program that's called Roots and Shoots.

我感到深深地愧疚，這也是為什麽在1991年，
There's little brochures all around outside,

在坦桑尼亞，我們開創了一個項目，叫做“根與芽”。
and if any of you have anything to do with children and care about their future,

外面有很多小冊子，
I beg that you pick up that brochure.

如果你需要幫助孩子或者關心他們的未來，
And Roots and Shoots is a program for hope.

我請求你們帶走一冊。
Roots make a firm foundation.

“根與芽”是關於希望的項目。
Shoots seem tiny,

根能建立堅實的基礎。
but to reach the sun they can break through brick walls.

芽看起來非常微小，
See the brick walls as all the problems

但是爲了接受太陽光，它們能夠衝破磚牆。
that we've inflicted on this planet.

把這些磚牆比作所有的問題
Then, you see, it is a message of hope.

那些這個星球上所有困擾我們的問題
Hundreds and thousands of young people around the world

所以，你能看出來，它傳遞著希望。
can break through, and can make this a better world.

世界各地成百上千的年輕人能夠
And the most important message of Roots and Shoots

突破這些困擾，創造一個更美好的世界。
is that every single individual makes a difference.

根與芽想傳遞的最重要的信念是
Every individual has a role to play.

每個人的努力都很有意義。
Every one of us impacts the world around us everyday,

每個人都有角色需要扮演。
and you scientists know that you can't actually --

我們每天都會影響到這個世界，
even if you stay in bed all day, you're breathing oxygen

你們這些科學家都知道，
and giving out CO2, and probably going to the loo,

即不可能完全，即使你整天躺在床上，你也在呼入氧氣，
and things like that --

呼出二氧化碳，上廁所，
you're making a difference in the world.

以及其他這些事情。
So, the Roots and Shoots program

你在幫助改變世界。
involves youth in three kinds of projects.

所以，根與芽項目
And these are projects to make the world around them a better place.

有三種項目可以讓年輕人參與。
One project to show care and concern for your own human community.

這些項目能夠把他們周圍的世界變得更加美好。
One for animals, including domestic animals -- and I have to say,

一項就是向你所在的人類社區表示關懷和友愛。
I learned everything I know about animal behavior

一項是動物方面的，包括那些家禽-這裡我不得不提，
even before I got to Gombe and the chimps from my dog, Rusty,

我學到的所有關於動物行為的知識
who was my childhood companion.

在我到貢貝接觸那些黑猩猩前，是從我的狗Rusty身上學到的，
And the third kind of project: something for the local environment.

它是我童年的玩伴。
So what the kids do depends first of all, how old are they --

第三項，是爲當地環境所做的事情。
and we go now from pre-school right through university.

所以小孩子能做什麽，首先取決於他們多大-
It's going to depend whether they're inner-city or rural.

我們現在包括了學前兒童到大學生。
It's going to depend if they're wealthy or impoverished.

根據他們是來自城區或者鄉下。
It's going to depend which part, say, of America they're in.

根據他們是富裕還是貧窮。
We're in every state now, and the problems in Florida

還根據他們在美國的那個地區。
are different from the problems in New York.

我們的機構現在遍佈各個州，佛羅里達的問題
It's going to depend on which country they're in --

不同於紐約的問題。
and we're already in 60-plus countries, with about 5,000 active groups --

也根據他們的所在國家
and there are groups all over the place that I keep hearing about

我們機構遍佈超過60個國家，約五千個活動團體--
that I've never even heard of, because the kids are taking the program

我經常從各地的團體中聽說一些，
and spreading it themselves.

我以前從未聽說過的：孩子們正在參與這個項目，
Why?

主動在宣傳這個項目。
Because they're buying into it,

爲什麽？
and they're the ones who get to decide what they're going to do.

因為他們相信我們所做的事情，
It isn't something that their parents tell them,

他們是決定自己想要做什麽的人。
or their teachers tell them.

不是父母告訴他們這樣去做，
That's effective, but if they decide themselves,

或者是老師教導他們來做。
"We want to clean this river

儘管老師和父母的教導更有效，但是如果是他們自己決定，
and put the fish back that used to be there.

“我們想把河水變清，
We want to clear away the toxic soil

讓魚回到它們原來在的地方。
from this area and have an organic garden.

我們想清理
We want to go and spend time with the old people

這一地區有毒的土壤，建造一個有機的花園。
and hear their stories and record their oral histories.

我們想去到養老院，花時間陪伴那些老年人
We want to go and work in a dog shelter.

聽他們講年輕時的故事，記錄他們說出的歷史。
We want to learn about animals. We want ... "

我們想給流浪狗搭建狗窩。
You know, it goes on and on, and this is very hopeful for me.

我們想瞭解動物。我們想......"
As I travel around the world 300 days a year,

你知道，這會不斷繼續下去。對我而言，我覺得很有希望。
everywhere there's a group of Roots and Shoots of different ages.

一年有300天我在世界給地奔波，
Everywhere there are children with shining eyes saying,

每個地區都有不同年齡群組成的根與芽團體。
"Look at the difference we've made."

每個地方都有那些忽閃著大眼睛的小孩跟我說，
And now comes the technology into it,

”看我們的努力帶來了多大的變化呀。”
because with this new way of communicating electronically

現在有了現代科技可以利用，
these kids can communicate with each other around the world.

因為有了電子通訊設備
And if anyone is interested to help us, we've got so many ideas

這些孩子可以和世界各地的夥伴交流。
but we need help -- we need help to create the right kind of system

如果有人有意幫助我們，我們確實有著很多想法
that will help these young people to communicate their excitement.

但是我們需要幫忙，來建立新的、正確的機制
But also -- and this is so important -- to communicate their despair,

幫助這些年輕人傳達他們興奮的心情。
to say, "We've tried this and it doesn't work, and what shall we do?"

此外，這一點非常重要，傳達出他們的絕望，
And then, lo and behold, there's another group answering these kids

有人曾說過，“我們已經試過但沒有用，我們到底該怎麼辦？”
who may be in America, or maybe this is a group in Israel,

之後，就會有別的團體，答覆這些發問的人
saying, "Yeah, you did it a little bit wrong. This is how you should do it."

回答的人可能來自美國，亦或是來自以色列，
The philosophy is very simple.

回答說，“你做的有點不正確，應該這麼做...”
We do not believe in violence.

這個邏輯非常簡單。
No violence, no bombs, no guns.

我們不相信暴力。
That's not the way to solve problems.

沒有暴力，沒有炸彈，沒有槍支。
Violence leads to violence, at least in my view.

那些不是解決問題的辦法。
So how do we solve?

暴力只能帶來暴力，至少我認為是這樣。
The tools for solving the problems are knowledge and understanding.

那我們該如何解決問題呢？
Know the facts, but see how they fit in the big picture.

解決問題的工具就是知識與理解。
Hard work and persistence --don't give up --

瞭解事實，並且知道這些知識該如何在大環境下加以運用。
and love and compassion leading to respect for all life.

努力工作，堅持下來-不要放棄
How many more minutes? Two, one?

愛和同情會帶來對所有生命的尊重。
Chris Anderson: One -- one to two.

我還有多久時間？兩分鐘？一分鐘？
Jane Goodall: Two, two, I'm going to take two.

克里斯安德森：一到兩分鐘。
(Laughter)

珍古德：兩分鐘吧，給我兩分鐘。
Are you going to come and drag me off?

（笑）
(Laughter)

你會上來把我拉下去嗎？
Anyway -- so basically, Roots and Shoots

（笑）
is beginning to change young people's lives.

無論如何-基本上，根與芽
It's what I'm devoting most of my energy to.

逐漸在改變年輕人的生活。
And I believe that a group like this can have a very major impact,

我現在最多的時間都是在做這個。
not just because you can share technology with us,

我相信，像這樣的團體能夠發揮很大的作用，
but because so many of you have children.

不僅僅是因為你我可以共享技術，
And if you take this program out, and give it to your children,

而是因為你們這麼多人都有孩子。
they have such a good opportunity to go out and do good,

如果你把這計畫講給其他人，講給你的孩子，
because they've got parents like you.

他們就會有這麼好的機會走出去，做善事，
And it's been so clear how much you all care

因為他們有像你們這樣善良的父母。
about trying to make this world a better place.

你們非常關心如何把世界變得更美好，
It's very encouraging.

這是顯而易見的。
But the kids do ask me --

很鼓舞人心。
and this won't take more than two minutes, I promise --

孩子們問我-
the kids say, "Dr. Jane, do you really have hope for the future?

接下來要說的不會超過兩分鐘，我保證-
You travel, you see all these horrible things happening."

這些孩子們說 “珍博士，你對未來抱有希望嗎？
Firstly, the human brain -- I don't need to say anything about that.

因為你四處旅行，看到過那麼多恐怖的事情。”
Now that we know what the problems are around the world,

首先，人類有聰明的大腦--這不用我說。
human brains like yours are rising to solve those problems.

我們既然知道了世界上存在的問題，
And we've talked a lot about that.

像你們這樣的人就會站出來解決那些問題。
Secondly, the resilience of nature.

關於這一點，我們剛才已經講了很多。
We can destroy a river,

第二，大自然有一定的自我修復能力。
and we can bring it back to life.

我們能夠污染河流，
We can see a whole area desolated,

我們也能夠把它恢復生機。
and it can be brought back to bloom again, with time or a little help.

我們看到有些地區完全荒蕪了，
And thirdly, the last speaker talked about -- or the speaker before last,

隨著時間，隨著我們的努力，它能夠重新變回綠洲。
talked about the indomitable human spirit.

第三，上一個演講者，或者是上上一個，
We are surrounded by the most amazing people

談到過人類不屈的精神。
who do things that seem to be absolutely impossible.

我們周圍有很許多讓人不可思議的人
Nelson Mandela -- I take a little piece of limestone

他們能夠完成完全不可能的任務。
from Robben Island Prison, where he labored for 27 years,

我從羅本島監獄-- 曼德拉（南非前總統）被監禁的地方
and came out with so little bitterness, he could lead his people

取到了一些石灰石，曼德拉被關了27年，
from the horror of apartheid without a bloodbath.

他卻很少受到這段悲慘遭遇的影響，他出獄後就能夠帶領他的人民
Even after the 11th of September -- and I was in New York

沒有流血打仗就成功地擺脫了種族隔離。
and I felt the fear -- nevertheless, there was so much human courage,

在911之後，我當時在紐約
so much love and so much compassion.

我感到非常恐懼-- 然而，無論如何，人民的勇氣還是巨大的，
And then as I went around the country after that and felt the fear --

有著許許多多的愛和同情。
the fear that was leading to people feeling

之後，我到了全國各地，又一次感覺到恐懼-
they couldn't worry about the environment any more,

那種讓人們感覺到
in case they seemed not to be patriotic --

他們不能再把心思花在環境上，
and I was trying to encourage them,

因為就會被認為不愛國的恐懼
somebody came up with a little quotation from Mahatma Gandhi,

我試圖去鼓勵他們，
"If you look back through human history,

有些人引用甘地的話回應我，
you see that every evil regime has been overcome by good."

"如果你回望人類的歷史，
And just after that a woman brought me this little bell,

你會發現，所有邪惡的政權最終都被優秀的政權取代。“
and I want to end on this note.

在那之後，一位婦女給我帶來了這只小鈴鐺，
She said, "If you're talking about hope and peace, ring this.

我想以此這張字條結束。
This bell is made from metal from a defused landmine,

她說，”當你談論起希望和安寧時，請搖這個鈴。
from the killing fields of Pol Pot --

這個鈴是用拆除的炸彈做成的，
one of the most evil regimes in human history --

取自波布執政時的戰場(柬埔寨)--
where people are now beginning to put their lives back together

人類歷史上最邪惡的政權之一，
after the regime has crumbled.

現在，那些政權被剷除以後
So, yes, there is hope, and where is the hope?

人民的生活重新恢復正常。
Is it out there with the politicians?

所以，希望是有的，在哪裡呢？
It's in our hands.

是在政治家那裡嗎？
It's in your hands and my hands

不，是在我們手裡。
and those of our children.

在你我的手裡
It's really up to us.

在孩子們的手裡。
We're the ones who can make a difference.

希望取決於我們。
If we lead lives where we consciously leave

我們才是能夠改變世界的人。
the lightest possible ecological footprints,

如果我們在生活中，自覺地
if we buy the things that are ethical for us to buy

把對生態的破壞降到最低，
and don't buy the things that are not,

如果我們只買那些製作符合道德的東西，
we can change the world overnight.

拒買那些不道德的，
Thank you.

在很短時間內，我們就能夠做出改變。

【TED】簡-古道爾。我們與黑猩猩的區別是什麼？(What separates us from chimpanzees? | Jane Goodall) (【TED】Jane Goodall: What separates us from chimpanzees? (What separates us from chimpanzees? | Jane Goodall))