I'm honored to be joined by my friend and mentor Gary Yourofsky, who has graciously

本人深感榮幸我的朋友兼導師--蓋瑞加里尤樂夫斯基

agreed to be here and answer questions that you, the Bite Size Vegan audience, have sent

非常殷切地答應來到這裡回答Bite Size Vegan的聽眾們傳送過來的問題

to me. I'm going to be releasing this interview in a series of videos, so be sure to stay

至於我，我將把這次訪談製作成一系列的影片所以請繼續鎖定我們的頻道

tuned to the channel. Gary I just wanted to thank you so much for taking time out of your

所以請繼續鎖定我們的頻道蓋瑞，我要大大謝謝您

busy schedule to be here and answer some of these questions.

在繁忙中撥出時間來到這裡以及回答一些問題

Gary: Anything for you Emily.

我願意為您做任何事，艾蜜莉謝謝您！

Emily: Thank you.

Emily: When you are trying to educate about veganism and you come up against someone who

00:00:27,170 --> 00:00:32,300當你試著傳遞純素主義而出現了一些...

is either actively combative, or just does not seem to want to hear what you are saying,

一些好戰份子，或只是看起來不想聽你訊息的人

is there a point at which you walk away? And how do you know when it's that point? Especially

是否有你會放棄（離開）的停損點以及你如何知道，何時就是那個點？

if it's someone that may be a family member or a close friend?

如果那是位家庭成員或很親密的朋友

Gary: Family members and friends are the toughest people to talk to when converting anyways,

家庭成員和朋友是當你試著轉換聽眾想法時，溝通起來最困難的人

so I would not waste too much time on them. Believe it or not, even though I've converted

因此我不會浪費太多時間在他們身上信不信由你，雖然我已經轉換了

some say hundreds of thousands of people now worldwide because of my videos being passed

有些人說世界上有幾十萬人因我的影片已在youtube和臉書被到處轉發

around on YouTube and Facebook, I've had virtually no success with friends and family members.

但實際上在說服朋友或家人我卻一次也沒有成功過 TT

Give me a crowd of strangers, I could rock the house, I could convert people that I've

給我一大群陌生人，我可以撼動這場子可以讓這些素未謀面的人們轉念

never met, inside of 45 minutes. Friends and family members though, they're the toughest

在45分鐘以內但朋友和家人，卻是全世界最困難的

people in the world. Don't spend too long with them. Give them a chance, everybody deserves

別花太多時間在他們身上給他們一個機會，每個人都應得

a chance, I give everyone a chance when I walk into a classroom. But after my speech,

當走進一間教室，我會給每個人一次機會但在我的演講之後

if you start saying the same dumb things and stupid questions, I'll cut you off after a

如果你還是在談論那些同樣的蠢事和蠢問題我會很快切斷和你的對話

few and say you know what man you need to go home and relax. You need to think about

然後說，嘿老兄，你需要回家放鬆一下也需要好好想想我剛剛說的事情

what I said. Your foundations are crumbled, and you need to rebuild those foundations

你的信念基礎已崩潰以後你必須重建這些基礎

later on and take a break. So I don't even spend too much time with people who are being

也放鬆一下所以我不會花太多時間在好鬥的人身上

combative. Now I'm fortunate, because most of my crowd is not combative, so I get to

現在我很幸運因為我大部分的群眾都不好鬥

talking to educate. But those are the people I'm looking for. And I've become a great psychologist

所以我能夠與他們溝通並給予教育這些人才是我要找的人

over the years, lecturing the 60,000+ students. I walk into a classroom and I'm like good

經過這幾年，我也變成一個厲害的心理學家對六萬名以上的學生講課

person, bad, good, bad, on the fence, on the fence, uh oh trouble, and when I see those

當我走進一間教室，就開始觀察嗯，好人，壞，好，壞，中立，中立，喔有麻煩

troublemakers, in fact I won't even call on them when they raise their hands. I know who

當我發現這些麻煩製造者事實上我根本不會點他們起來發言

the troublemakers are. Now sometimes professors get involved in the Q and A and they call

我知道誰是來找碴的有時候課程教授會參與問答時間

on them, so it turns into a little chaotic scene, but I avoid those troublemakers altogether.

而教授點了這些人起來發言導致場面變得有點混亂但我則會完全避開這些麻煩人士

I've been doing this for 18 years though, I'm a little tired and I don't want to fight

我已經做這件事18年了（推廣動物權）我有點累，也不想再與人爭辯

anymore, I don't. I'll fight for the animals, I will preach for the animals, I will die

我真的不想...我會為動物而戰我會為動物而宣講我願為動物而死

for the animals, they can put me in jail for the animals, but I don't want to fight anymore

甚至因動物而被關進大牢但我不想再與人爭吵

this is so simple to me that I'm looking for the people who are understanding the messages.

對我來說很簡單我在找尋了解這些訊息的人們

I lay it out throughout the speech, and I want to have a discussion with them about

我藉由演講來將這些訊息散布出去也想要與聽眾們討論這些內容

it, and help them make the conversion. Because that's really the toughest part of converting

以及幫助他們作轉換因為這才是轉換最困難的部分

somebody, is to explain to them, okay where are you going to eat from now on? Where are

是對人們說明好，從今天起你要去哪吃飯？

you going to shop from now on? So once I get to those questions I just, that's where I

從今天起你要去哪買東西？所以當我遇到了這些問題

want to be and help people make that conversion.

這才是我想出現並協助人們轉換生活習慣的地方

Emily: I think something that a lot of new vegans struggle with sometimes is non-vegan

我想有時候很多新純素者會掙扎於非純素者的朋友或家人

friends or family which we spoke a little bit about. But I've had some people ask, do

也就是我們剛剛有談到的一些問題我聽過一些詢問

you have any non-vegan friends, and if so, how do you navigate that friendship?

您是否有任何非純素的朋友若有，您是如何來維持這段友誼？

Gary: Yes I do. My oldest and dearest friend Darren of 35+ years is still in my life. Although

是的，我有位35年以上最久也最親愛的朋友戴倫，他仍然在我的生命中

we've drifted apart over the last few years but I've drifted from everybody. All the violence

在最近幾年我們有漸漸疏離但我同時也已與所有人漸漸疏遠

in the world, all the evil in the world has made me a misanthropic recluse. So my entire

所有世界上的這些暴力及邪惡已經把我變成一個厭世的隱居者

goal in life after I'm done preaching is to get back home, get back to the hotel, I don't

所以在我演講完後的目標只是回家或回到飯店

hang out with too many people. But you don't have to be vegan to be in my life, you just

我不和很多人打交道但你不必一定要是位純素者，才能進入我的生命

have to be honest and truthful. Like Darren looks me in the eye and says Gary come on

你只需要誠實和真誠像是戴倫，他看著我的眼睛，說

man you're right about everything, animals don't deserve this. I'm too lazy to switch,

“蓋瑞，拜託～你說的全部都對動物不應被這樣對待，但我實在很懶得作轉變

what do you want from me? Now I despise his laziness, but I love his honesty. Because

你到底還想要我怎樣嘛？”現在我雖討厭他的懶惰，但卻欣賞他的誠實

if you're honest with me that prevents a fight from happening. The fights happen with non-vegans

因為你若對我誠實，就可避免爭執爭執通常起於當非純素者

when they start lying about what's going on. Animals don't feel, animals can't think, God

開始說些對實際發生的事實的謊言比如動物沒有感覺，動物不會思考

says it's okay, I need my protein that's the only way. Now we're going to have a fight,

神說這樣沒關係我需要蛋白質，吃動物是唯一的方法如此一來我們就會起爭執

because those are just complete and utter lies. It's absolute stupidity to be saying

因為那些就只是完完全全的謊言說出這些話是非常愚蠢的

things like that. So if you can avoid saying that to me, you don't have to be vegan to

所以若能避免對我說這些話你不需成為純素者，也能成為我生命的一部分

be in my life. However, tough to get into my life at this stage in the game.

然而，在這場遊戲的這個階段你將很難踏入我的人生

Hey guys, it's Emily. I just wanted to let you know that there's a bonus part 2 of this

嗨各位，這是艾蜜莉我想讓你知道我們有附贈第二部分

video in which Gary talks about his one rule for eating with non-vegans. You can check

關於蓋瑞談論他與非純素者共食的規則

it out by clicking here. I've posted it over on the Bite Size Vegan Patreon page, but as

你可以點這裡來欣賞影片我已將它放到Bite Size Vegan的贊助者頁面

a public post so you don’t have to be a patron to watch. But, while you’re over

但這個分享是公開的你不需要是贊助者也可觀賞

there, you might as well take a look at the awesome perks that you get for being a member

但既然你已經在這了不如看看成為雞塊大軍會員的各項福利

of the Nugget Army like access to even more bonus footage! With you support as a patron

比如可進入更多紅利影片！若能有您的贊助

I can keep veganizing via video and spreading the message. before we return to the interview

我可以繼續用影片以及傳遞訊息來純素化這個世界

to close it out with Gary, now that you've heard his perspective on how he deals with

在我們結束對蓋瑞的訪問前現在你已經聽到他對於如何處理

non-vegan friends and family and those who are a bit combative, I want to hear your experience.

對於非純素朋友，家人，及一些比較好戰聽眾之間關係的分享我也想聽聽您的經驗

If you're vegan, I would love to hear how you interact with non-vegan friends and family.

如果您是純素者我非常希望能聽聽您如何與非純素朋友及家人互動的經驗

And if you're a non-vegan out there, I would love to hear your perspective of your interactions

如果您是非純素者我也很想聽聽您與純素者互動的觀點

with vegans and if there are approaches that you've found more effective versus more off-putting.

以及是否有更有效率的溝通方式以避免令雙方不愉快的場面

So let me know in the comments below and now we'll return to close things out with Gary.

所以請留言在下方我們現在將回到訪問蓋瑞的現場並為訪談做個結束

Emily: Gary I just want to thank you so much for giving us your time and I've been asked

蓋瑞，我真的很感謝您貢獻了您寶貴的時間

on behalf of so many of my viewers to just thank you for everything that you do. So thank

而我也代表我們的許多讀者來感謝您所做的一切

you so much.

非常感謝您！

Gary: Thank you. Keep on. Everybody pass her stuff around, it's tight stuff. Honestly,

謝謝您，也請繼續努力每個人都在將訊息傳出去，老實說這不容易

BiteSizeVegan.com, share it.

BiteSizeVegan.com 分享出去吧！

Emily: Stay tuned to the Bite Size Vegan channel for more installations of Gary's interview.

不要轉臺，這裏有更多關於蓋瑞的訪談

I'll also be posting bonus footage of questions that don't make it to the channel, into the

我也將張貼更多本台尚未播出的紅利影片

VIP section of BiteSizeVegan.com, which you can access for free by signing up for the

在 BiteSizeVegan.com的VIP區您可免費註冊雞塊電子報以進入觀賞

Nugget newsletter. Give the video a thumbs-up if you enjoyed it, and be sure to subscribe

若您喜歡這影片，請給它一個"讚" 也請記得訂閱本頻道

so that you never miss a nugget. Now go live vegan, and I'll see you soon.

才不會漏掉訊息現在就吃純素吧！咱們很快就會再見