- So did I. Yeah, you saw it too.

我也是，我最近才重溫片段

- What a great show, I was LOL-ing for real.

真是精彩，我笑到不行

Just alone, and watching it.

光看就令人噴飯

- It holds up.

現在看還是很好笑

- It holds up, it's funny from beginning to end, all of it's funny.

真的，從頭到尾都很好笑

- Yeah, thank you.

是啊，謝謝

- Even I was funny, and didn't think I was.

連我都很好笑，我從來沒想過我能搞笑

- You were very funny.

妳超好笑的

- I was so nervous, I was so nervous, and you were cracking me up.

我當時很緊張，妳一直在逗我笑

Especially like in part two,

尤其是第二段

where you're talking about the civil rights and going to the back of the bus.

妳談到民權運動，黑人只能坐在巴士後面座位

And like, my God, do we have to go to the back of the bus too?

當時妳說，天啊，我們非得坐後座嗎？

Yeah, it was, everything, well,

是啊

I called you.

當時我打電話給妳

I was driving, I remember where I was.

我在開車，我清楚那時的情景

I was pulling onto the 101, and I called you, and asked if you would do this.

我當時開車，然後打給妳，問妳是否願意參與演出

And I was really shocked that you said yes.

沒想到妳會答應

And my second.. - I said yes immediately, did I not?

我二話不說就答應了，對吧？

- Yeah, you did, you did.

是啊，妳立刻答應

It wasn't even one of those,

我沒有片刻猶豫

wait, let me think, let me see.

沒說「讓我想想，給我點時間考慮」之類的話

- Right. - Yes, uh-huh.

是啊

- And my second choice was Maya Angelou.

我心中第二人選是作家 Maya Angelou

But you were my first choice.

但妳是我的第一選擇

And cuz I thought, first of all I love you, and you are the queen, and

因為我很喜歡妳，而且妳是脫口秀女王

I thought you would legitimize all of it.

沒人敢等閒看待這件事

You would make it like people would go, this is,

妳讓整件事變得很真實

we're not trying to make a joke of this.

別人不會覺得我們在搞笑

This is actually serious.

其實這是很嚴肅的事

- Well, the thing is, I didn't even think about, I didn't even give it a thought.

事實上，我根本沒多想

I didn't even think, gee, what will this cost me?

我沒想說，這會讓我受傷嗎？

What will other people say, how will I be presented?

別人會怎麼看我？我又該怎麼表演？

I just said yes, because I so believed in your truth, and I so

我二話不說就答應，因為我相信妳

wanted to support you.

我很想支持妳

- But did you, I mean, we've talked since then.

但妳是否...我們之前聊過

So when you said yes away, even though you've done all the shows about,

當妳答應邀約後，雖然妳當時在節目上也做過出櫃內容

at that time... - I was doing Coming Out Day on the show.

我是做過「出櫃日」的特輯

- Right. - But

是的

never using a dramatic format like what you had.

但從沒像妳一樣用戲劇方式呈現

You had a different platform, in which to reach millions of people,

呈現方式不同，戲劇接觸的觀眾數以百萬計

I heard 42 million people watched?

據說有4,200萬人收看那一集？

- Yeah, it was, at the time, I think,

是的

the largest audience of.... - Wow.

- 那時創下收視紀錄 - 哇

- So, but you got so much hate mail.

但妳當時收到很多惡意攻擊的信件

- I couldn't believe it.

我不敢置信

- I mean, like really nasty.

這些信件很可怕

- It was so bad, the next day after the show, I flew back to Chicago.

裡頭充滿仇很，我播出隔天便飛回芝加哥

And the next day, out switchboard,

隔天，電話被打爆

I mean, we had to put another person on the switchboard.

我們得多請派人手接電話

I remember something like 900 and something calls, they couldn't keep up.

我記得大概有900通電話，我們人手忙不過來

And I said, well, what are people saying?

我問工作人員，他們在抗議什麼？

And the switchboard operator's like, you don't wanna know, Ma'am,

負責接電話的人說，妳不會想知道的

you don't wanna know.

妳不會想聽的

And I said, no, I really want to know what they're saying.

我就說，我真的想聽聽看他們的意見

And so, I started looking at the sheet, and

所以我開始翻閱觀眾回應

there's a lot of, you go back to Africa.

有很多人叫我滾回非洲

And I was like, go back to Africa over a sitcom?

我心想，滾回非洲？ 這只不過是情境喜劇

I was on an sitcom, I was talking to Ellen, and she spoke her truth.

我當時扮演妳的心理治療師，然後妳向我出櫃

And a lot of the N-word, a lot of vile, vitriolic stuff.

還有很多人罵我「黑鬼」這類攻擊語言

And, I've been thinking about it, knowing I was gonna come on the show.

我一直在思考這件事，我在戲中軋上一角

And I was never so surprised, by the hatred

但我沒料到會遭到惡意攻擊

and how loud it was.

抗議聲浪會這麼大

Because up until that time,

那時候我才發現

I never had that kind of thing slamming me in the face.

我從沒有過這樣的經驗

And what I thought was, gee, I misread that everybody was like us.

那時我才知道，原來不是每個人都和我們一樣

That they were open-minded, and that they were receptive, and

擁有開放的心胸，願意包容別人的不同

that, wanted people just to be who they are.

鼓勵別人做自己

So it taught me a lot, actually, it really did.

這真的讓我上了一課

- Yeah, it really, it was surprising how many people lay upset.

真的，我沒料到那麼多人抗議

Because my whole thing, and I've said this before, that I was a comedian.

這整件事...我以前說過，我是諧星

I was funny, and I just so happen to be gay, and I just got tired of hiding it.

我負責搞笑，剛好我是同性戀，我不想再躲躲藏藏了

And I thought, well, nothing is going change, I'm still funny,

我心裡想，出櫃後也不會改變什麼事，我一樣搞笑

I'm still the same person.

我還是艾倫

They're just now going to know, and plus, I assumed that people did know.

只不過大家現在知道我是同性戀，而且我覺得觀眾早就猜到

I didn't think it was gonna be that much of a shock, and so it really-

我沒想過衝擊會那麼大

- But just 20 years ago,

不過 20 年前

nobody was actually saying it.

沒人敢出櫃

So I don't even think it was the shock,

我第一個想到的不是衝擊很大

it was like that woman, that clip that you ran earlier on my show.

而是像之前播的片段，裡頭有位女士所說的...

Like, you don't have to tell anybody.

「妳不必大聲宣告性向」

20 years ago, people kept things to themselves, they were quiet.

20 年前，大家不會把家務事攤在外人面前

You hid the fact that your husband had an affair, you didn't mention it.

如果妳老公外遇，妳不會和別人說

You were pretending to be who you weren't,

試圖欺騙自己，不願面對真相

in a way that we no longer find acceptable in our culture.

但我們現在覺得這樣不 ok

And you are responsible for so

其中妳的功勞很大

much of that changing, you were the bravest woman ever.

妳幫助社會改變，妳是史上最勇敢的女性

- I'm happy that I.... [APPLAUSE]

我很高興 [全場鼓掌]

- I found that in me.

我找到真正的自我

Thank you.

謝謝

When you think about it, when you think

當妳回想這整個過程

about the kind of courage it took, and I know I did a full-on interview with you.

這是多需要勇氣的事，我以前專訪妳時也談過

But now, with time and perspective, I mean, just watching the other

不過，現在回過頭來看

day for the first time since we did it.

再次重溫出櫃的片段

I was thinking, well, if I got that kind of hate mail and

我在想，連我都遭到這麼嚴重的攻擊

vitriol, what must you have gotten?

那妳的情況一定更糟吧？

And what must that have done to your spirit at that time?

妳當時心裡一定很受傷吧？

- Yeah, I have a lot of death threats, a lot.

是啊，當時很多人威脅要置我於死地

And a lot of, and there was a bomb scare when we shot.

當我們拍片時，很多人威脅要用炸彈攻擊我

But it was, yeah, it was tough.

當時真的很辛苦

I mean, there was always, that's how you,

這也是為何...

that's why most people don't come out as, cuz you think you can lose your career.

為何大家不敢出櫃的原因，妳會失去工作

And so, people just choose a career over being truthful.

大家覺得飯碗比忠於自我重要

And I just decided to feel that that was truthful,

我看法剛好相反

was more important than a career.

我覺得，忠於自己比較重要

- But were you ever really scared?

但妳心裡有真的怕過吧？

Were you ever afraid that some crazy would actually act on it?

妳會害怕有些極端份子對妳不利嗎？

- Yeah, and I did have some incidents where I'd be walking down the street.

會啊，有幾次我走在路上

And people would scream out of car, and scream at me, or, yeah.

有些人會從車上衝著我吼之類的

There were some violent things that happened.

的確有些人會攻擊我

But, and just being made fun of on late night television,

每天晚上的脫口秀節目

I was the butt of every joke.

我都是被嘲笑的對象

I was constantly made fun of, and so it just turned around.

我總是逃不過他們的揶揄，但現在已經不一樣

- You know what I think though?

妳知道我怎麼想的嗎？

This is what I think for

我在想...

everybody who goes through anything where you have denied the truth of yourself.

大家都經歷過否認自我的階段

And then you are brave enough, you have courage enough.

等到你有足夠的勇氣

You have the courage,

你擁有那股勇氣

because your whole calling is about you being who you were meant to be.

因為你的天命就是忠於自我

And the fact that you would not be who you are, Medal of freedom.

就是因為妳忠於自我，才能獲頒自由勳章的殊榮

President Obama wouldn't have said those wonderful things about you,

總統歐巴馬當時對妳的稱讚

that were all so true.

字字句句都是發自內心

You wouldn't have been able to open hearts, and touch hearts, and

妳一定得要有勇氣坦承自我，別人才會感動

change people's minds.

才能改變社會的想法

And make a difference in the world, had you not had the courage to do that.

然後改變世界的面貌

And 20 years ago, you had no idea it would put you in this seat.

20年前，妳完全不知道這會對妳有何影響

- No, no, and that's why I always encourage people,

我不知道，這就是為何我總鼓勵大家

cuz it really did teach me.

因為這真的讓我學到一件事

No matter what the cost is at the time, it is always important.

不論代價多麼高昂，永遠都要忠於自我

Like you said, whatever you believe, whoever the essence of us is.

像妳說的，我們之所以為人

We're born, we are all individual, we are all unique, and

我們生下來都是獨特的個體，每個人都不一樣

we are supposed to be that exact person.

我們應該活出真正的自己

We're not supposed to conform, we're not supposed be like somebody else,

不需要每個人都一樣，不必模仿別人

we're not supposed to act like somebody else.

每個人都是獨特的

And as long as you stay true to exactly who you are,

只要你忠於自我

you will be rewarded in ways that you can't imagine.

未來的回報遠超出妳想像

[APPLAUSE] - That's right, absolutely right.

[全場鼓掌] 真的，說得太好了

- All right, thanks for coming, you have a-

感謝妳來

[APPLAUSE]

[全場鼓掌]

- We have a message, a surprise message,

我們有個驚喜片段

so, I don't know, there's a lot of surprises today.

今天的驚喜太多了

- Okay.

請看

- Hi, Oprah.

嗨，歐普拉

Hi, Ellen.

嗨，艾倫

- Gosh, I wish I could be there

我真希望和你們在現場

in person, but Barack keeps booking us on all these vacations.

但我老公安排滿滿的度假行程

In fact, I think we've got a kite surfing lesson in about five minutes, so

等下還得去學風箏衝浪呢

I'm going to make this short and sweet.

所以我得長話短說

But seriously, Ellen, congratulations on the 20th

說真的，艾倫，我要恭喜妳

anniversary of announcing to the world who you really are.

出櫃20周年真的很難得

Time and again, you have shown us what love really means.

妳總向世人展現愛的真諦

You are brave, you are kind, you are a terrible person to go shopping with.

妳如此勇敢仁慈，但我還是不要和妳一起購物

- And I absolutely adore you.

我真的很愛妳喔

Congratulations again, love you much.

再次恭喜，愛妳

I love you too, Michelle!

蜜雪兒，我也愛妳

We'll be right back.

我們馬上回來