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Hey, it’s Marie Forleo and you are watching MarieTV, the place to be to create a business
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and life you love. And today you are in for such a treat because I have on an author who
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wrote a book I’ve mentioned many times before. If you’re interested in living a regret-free
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life, this is a must watch.
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Bronnie Ware is an Australian author, an international speaker, and a songwriter. Her bestselling
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first book The Top Five Regrets of the Dying, touched hearts all over the world with translations
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in 27 languages. Bronnie’s next book, Your Year for Change, is also in many translations.
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As well as being an author, Bronnie became a late in life mother and is a master of balance,
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conscious choice, saying no, and regret free living. Bronnie has released 2 albums of original
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songs and her third book is due to be released in the fall of 2016.
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Bronnie, thank you so much for being here on MarieTV.
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It’s my pleasure, absolute pleasure.
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So I know you’ve heard we’ve talked about your book several times on the show, so it’s
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such an honor to actually get to talk to you about the whole process. So let’s go back,
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you know, you had the opportunity to be with so many souls through your work in palliative
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care. How quickly did you start to notice some common threads in the regrets?
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It was certainly within the first year.
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Yeah?
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Yeah. So I worked on and off for 8 years with dying people, so quite soon. Yeah. Quite soon
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into the journey. It was like, “Hang on, I’ve… I’ve had this conversation before.
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What’s… what’s going on here?”
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And did you start writing things down or taking notes?
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Well, I always kept a journal anyway and because my patients were often asleep or resting,
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I had a lot… lot of long hours. So I would just write in a journal, not having any idea
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that it was actually a future book coming together. It was more just about my life and
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how it was being influenced by the people I was looking after individually. So, yeah,
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I just kept writing and… and over time I found myself writing similar things, you know,
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as well as having those similar conversations.
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So… and what was the journey like? So you did all of this incredible work and then take
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us to the point where you were inspired to write the blog post.
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I’d just finished working with dying people. I was in a place where I really wanted to
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work where there was some hope and obviously, you know, once people are dying, they’re
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on their last chapter. So I’d managed to set up a songwriting program in a women’s
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jail and an editor for a magazine asked me to write an article about that, about how
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the songwriting course came about. And so I was teaching guitar and songwriting to female
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inmates at the time and when I wrote that article I thought, “This is crazy. I love
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writing. You know, why aren’t I writing more? I’ll start a blog.” And so I thought,
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“Well, what do I write about?” And I got some very clear guidance, “Just write what
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you know.” And I thought, “Ok, well, you know, I’ve just finished working with dying
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people. I’ll write about that time in my life.” And so I just sat down with… with
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really no forethought at all and just thought, “Ok, well, how has it affected me the most?
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Why, you know, what have I learned from the dying people the most?” And straight away
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it was regrets and I thought, “Oh, of course,” you know. “It’s been shaping my life for
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the last 8 years.” And, yeah, so I ended up writing the article based on my old notes
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but also just on my memory of the conversations, posted the article, and then for about 6 months
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it sat. It had a little bit of movement here and there where people asked to share it and
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then about 6 months later it just went… and I wasn’t ready for that sort of publicity
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6 months earlier. So I was growing into that readiness for it and… and then in time that
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grew into a book and… yeah. The rest is history.
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Yeah. So was it shared about 3 million times?
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In the first year it was shared 3 million. In the first 2 or 3 years it was well over
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8 million views. Yes.
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Wow.
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Yes, yeah. It’s hard to comprehend, really.
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And what were some of the notes and the letters that you were getting from people? Because
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it’s… I mean, the ideas and the concepts are very simple but they hit you right in
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the heart and for so many of us, myself included, it resonates as the truth.
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Yes. Yeah. And I think that’s what… what happened is it did resonate with so many,
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but I think the simplicity of it was part of the appeal and that it gives people permission
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to actually make those choices because it’s not just someone else telling them, it’s…
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it’s dying people who have… who were walking their talk. You know, they had the regret
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at the end. And… and it was so, so strong, the message. So I think it was mostly about
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just the simplicity of it and the permission to let it go for the reader. Yeah.
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I’m curious, when you were actually hearing those regrets, as you’re a sensitive soul,
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you’re a creative soul, was it hard emotionally to be there and stand there and care for these
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people at the same time have so much emotion that you’re absorbing and listening to?
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The… the level of anguish and frustration that the dying people shared, expressed while
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they were sharing these regrets, was impossible not to be affected by. But I also had to trust
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that that was their life path and at least they were learning those things at the end.
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And some of them made me promise that I would share their wisdom on so that people would
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learn from their mistakes. So if anything I just felt very honored and… and grateful
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to be that messenger and to also have the lesson given to me repeatedly so that I was
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actually incorporating it into my own life. I couldn’t teach it without walking it myself,
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so if anything it was… as heartbreaking as it often was for me, there were plenty
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of tears in the bathroom with the door closed during those years, but as difficult as that
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was it was also far more an honor than anything to work in that role.
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Let’s take a look at regret number one, which is so powerful. I wish I’d had the
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courage to live a life true to myself, not the life others expected of me. And I was
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so moved by Grace’s story, specifically when she said, “I mean it. Promise this
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dying woman that you will always be true to yourself, that you will be brave enough to
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live the way you want to, regardless of what other people will say.”
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Yeah. Grace still affects me on a day to day basis. You know, not always consciously but…
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but those months with her were certainly life changing. And she had stayed… she’d stayed
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in a marriage that was very unhappy and then as soon as her husband went into a nursing
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home she was diagnosed with terminal illness and it was quite aggressive. So all of the
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dreams that she’d put on hold thinking maybe she’d get some freedom at some stage in
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her life were gone. There was nothing she could do about it. And she was just a little,
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really small lady but she was… she was fierce in her… her resolution and her determination
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to make me promise her. And, she… yeah, her regret was… was so tangible. It was
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shocking. Yeah.
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And did you hear those similar kind of words from so many of the other people?
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Over and over and over. Just, “Do your own thing, love. Don't listen to what other people
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say. I wish I hadn’t done this. I wish I hadn’t done that.” You know, it’s…
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it came from all different angles and men and women. Just all different circumstances,
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but really in a nutshell the same message over and over and over and over. Yeah.
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And then regret number 2, which is one that I think will resonate not only with our culture
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right now but especially for entrepreneurs and hardcore creatives.
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Yes.
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The regret I wish I hadn’t worked so hard. Goodness gracious. Every time I pick up your
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book, I look at the blog post, because I do look at it often because I just feel like
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it’s so important to be…
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It is.
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...reminded of these ideas. And John’s story is something that I don't think anyone watching
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this show couldn’t relate to. When he says, you know, “Don't create a life where you’re
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going to regret working too hard.” He said, “Even though I didn't know I was gonna regret
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it, deep in my heart I knew I was working too hard.” And I think there’s so much
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wisdom in that.
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Yes. Yes.
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On one level you don't think you’re gonna regret it. But there’s a small voice inside,
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isn’t there? When we’re pushing too hard and you can start to feel a soulful tug. I
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know I’ve experienced it at times where I’m being really hard on myself, trying
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to push, trying to make something happen, trying to meet a deadline and I can feel Josh
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or I can, you know, Kuma will come up and, you know, animals do the…
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Yes.
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...pawing you kind of thing. And I can feel like a little part of my soul going, “Put
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the work down.” So I’m just curious if you have anything else to add.
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Well, it… it is, you know, so many of us love our work and so it’s not about not
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loving your work and… and we can get really caught up in it and just get, you know, carried
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along. And… but there’s no point of success if there’s not balance with it because work
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isn't our whole life and there is that little voice. So as much as we can get caught up
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in the busyness or the… the enjoyment, the striving of it, there is that little voice
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that will say, “Oh, hang on a sec. This is…” and we can suppress it, but eventually
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we’re either going to have to honor that voice or have that regret. Because there’s
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so much more to life than our work and it’s wonderful when the two become one, when you
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love your work so much it’s a huge part of your life, but there are plenty of other
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aspects in our lives that really deserve a lot of attention as well. And sometimes that’s
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just being and turning off the phone and sitting at the beach or going for a walk. Just acknowledging
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that… that it’s ok to switch off from work and give some solid time to other important
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aspects of our lives.
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After you’ve been able to share this message now with millions and millions of people,
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how has it informed your day to day choices? Did you make any big choices that you feel
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like because of these regrets, because you know them and you’ve written them and you
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shared them that you found yourself at a crossroads where you could go one way or the other and
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this helped inform…?
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There’s… I can’t count how many decisions I’ve made based on this and how many small
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and large crossroads. But if I’m faced with a decision that takes a lot of courage and
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I find that courage now because I think, “Ok, I can go this way, it might be the easy way,
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or I can go this way. It feels harder, scarier or whatever, but this is actually where I
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want to go.” And I think, “I’m either gonna regret this or I’m not, you know,
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which… which way causes no regrets?” The hard way, the challenging way, face the courage
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way. And so you do become more and more courageous, you know, as you start using this as a tool
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for living, you know, using the wisdom from the dying as a tool for living. And so many
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decisions I make, even small decisions now, ultimately they’re affected, they’ve been
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shaped by these regrets. Because if it’s not going to feel good for me, I don't do
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it anymore. I just… I say no to way more than I say yes to. I… I love yes, don't
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worry. I, you know, I love the word yes, but I’ve learned to comfortably say no to so
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many things without guilt, without explanation, just because I know there’s other things
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that will feel better for me and that no one’s really at a loss if I say no. It doesn't matter,
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you know, we have to follow our own heart’s calling and that heart’s calling ends up
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benefiting everyone in the long run anyway.
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Do you feel like your intuition has gotten stronger?
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Yes.
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Yes.
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Yes. Yeah, it’s a guiding light.
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Because you probably hear it and listen to it more perhaps than you did in the past.
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Well, that’s right. Yeah. I often think about the Buddhist quote, the heart knows
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no questions, the mind knows no answers. And I think all of us have been shaped by, you
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know, we try and reason with logic in our mind but the more we can actually follow our
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heart, which is our intuition and, you know, our… our longing, then the louder it speaks.
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In fact, it starts singing after a while, it doesn't just speak.
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Yes! I often feel like mine is so loud, like, I cannot ignore it.
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Exactly.
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And it’s pretty visceral.
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Fantastic. Well, thank goodness you did.
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Yes.
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Thank goodness you did for all of us.
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And I will say too, and I just wanted to say how deeply honored I am that you’re a B-Schooler
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in the B-School community. Clearly you were very successful before, but when I found that
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out my heart cracked open and I was like, “What a pillar of the world,” and we have
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the honor of being connected in that way as well.
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Oh, yes. It was wonderful when I realized you were connected to my work in the same
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way. And B-School has brought some of the most gorgeous women into my life and locally
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I just have the most wonderful tribe. And we’re all B-Schoolers, there's no… no
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competition, we’re all lovingly supporting each other’s journey. If any of them have
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similar career paths they collaborate rather than compete and it’s all thanks to you,
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Marie. So B-School is a positive place.
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I… that is so lovely to hear because I think one of the things many of us are starving
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for in this day and age is a sense of community and connection and I talk about that with
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my friends a lot. Because no matter how wonderful technology is and it forms these beautiful
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connections, in some ways it can feel very isolating as well.
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Sure.
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And so I love, love, love to hear that. You know, you write something so beautiful. You
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say, “The piece each of these dear people found before their passing is available now.
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Without having to wait until your final hours, you have the choice to change your life, to
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be courageous, to live a life true to your heart, one that will see you past without
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regret.” Bronnie, what’s the closing thought you’d like to leave us with today?
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That it’s ok to be happy and it’s ok to live the life your heart calls you to.
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Thank you so much. You’re a beautiful, beautiful human being and thank you for putting this
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work into the world.
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It’s my pleasure. Thank you so much, Marie.
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Now Bronnie and I would love to hear from you. What was the biggest insight that you’re
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taking away from today’s episode? As always, the richest discussions happen after the episode
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over at MarieForleo.com, so go there and leave a comment now. Did you like this video? If
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going for your dreams, because the world needs that special gift that only you have. Thank
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you so much for watching and I’ll catch you next time on MarieTV.