Name: 為何「奇怪」的職涯轉變，反而能帶來成長？諾華藥廠執行長 Vas Narasimhan 分享！ (Why ‘Strange’ Career Moves Often Lead to Growth — with Novartis CEO Vas Narasimhan)
Uploaded: 2026-03-05T17:46:04.000Z
Duration: 33 min 28 s

動名詞

Every leader's journey is shaped by a handful of defining decisions, those moments of risk, doubt and conviction that influence their lives and careers.

每個領導者的旅程都由幾個決定性的選擇形塑，那些充滿風險、疑慮和信念的時刻，影響著他們的人生和職涯。

to 不定詞

In this podcast, we get to hear the stories behind those choices.

在這個 Podcast 中，我們將聽到這些選擇背後的故事。

Welcome to Executive Decisions with me, Steve Sedgwick.

歡迎收聽《Executive Decisions》，我是 Steve Sedgwick。

In this episode, I speak to Baz Narasimhan, the CEO of pharmaceutical company Novartis.

本集節目，我將與諾華藥廠的執行長 Baz Narasimhan 對談。

I think it's easy to get too fixed kind of in your career as well, and

我覺得在職涯上，很容易變得太過僵化，

I think to be open to possibilities that a decision in one direction could open three others decision doors in another direction.

而且要對各種可能性保持開放，因為一個方向的決定，可能會在另一個方向開啟三個不同的機會。

As the son of two first generation immigrants to United States, Faz's life and career have been guided by a core mission instilled by his parents by bringing me back to India.

作為第一代移民到美國的父母的孩子，Faz 的人生和職涯一直以來都由父母灌輸的核心使命所引導，他們希望我能回饋印度。

Many times in my youth, particularly my mom, she would always take us back to say, you've had these extraordinary opportunities to get to the US to get an education.

在我年輕的時候，特別是我的媽媽，她總是會帶我們回想，你們有這些難得的機會來到美國接受教育。

Like, what could you do to impact the world with the opportunities that you've been given?

像是，你如何運用你所擁有的機會，對世界產生影響？

After attending Harvard Medical School, Vaz considered becoming a doctor, but

在哈佛醫學院畢業後，Vaz 曾考慮成為一名醫生，但

instead he went to consultancy McKinney before settling at Novartis.

他轉而去了顧問公司 McKinney，之後才進入 Novartis。

When he eventually became CEO, the company was embroiled in scandal and faced several investigations.

當他最終成為執行長時，公司正捲入醜聞並面臨多項調查。

Talk about getting thrown into the maelstrom.

It's easy to coach new CEOs about these things, but

教導新任執行長處理這些事情很容易，但

when you go through it and it's the first time it's your name and seeing all of that, it's jarring.

當你親身經歷，而且是第一次以你的名字面對這一切時，那種衝擊感真的很強烈。

These are Vas Narasiman's executive decisions.

這些都是 Vas Narasiman 的執行長決策。

I've had the privilege of interviewing you throughout your career as a CEO at Novartis, but

在你的職涯中，我有幸在 Novartis 擔任執行長期間採訪過你，但我

And as my preparation for this has gone on, I've just found you unbelievably fascinating already as well.

隨著我為這次採訪做的準備，我已經覺得你非常引人入勝了。

Why don't we start off earlier on, though, with your parents and the importance of where you come from.

不過，我們是不是可以早點從你的父母和你來自哪裡的重要性開始聊起？

I always say we stand on the shoulders of giants.

我一直說，我們是站在巨人的肩膀上。

And I think about the journey of my grandparents coming from really small villages in southern India, farming villages, my parents making the grand trek from India to the United States, and

我想到我祖父母從印度南部的小村莊、務農的村莊來到這裡的旅程，我父母從印度遠赴美國，

then growing up as an immigrant kid in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, a steel town, but

然後在賓州的匹茲堡長大，一個鋼鐵小鎮，但

And they put inside of me the values I think I cared for.

他們在我心中種下了我認為很重視的價值觀。

You try to impact the world in a positive way.

你試著用正面的方式影響世界。

You're always trying to learn about yourself and learn about the world.

你總是試著認識自己、認識世界。

So it's been very grateful for all that they've done.

所以真的很感謝他們所做的一切。

Your father was a senior executive at Huguenots Corporation as well.

你爸爸也曾在 Huguenots Corporation 擔任高階主管。

Having a mom, especially with that kind of pedigree, is phenomenal.

有這樣一位媽媽，尤其是她有這樣的背景，真的很棒。

我媽媽是個非常非常優秀的人。

And she, she managed to raise three boys while being a nuclear engineer at Westinghouse, while still trying to make ends meet.

而且她，她身為 Westinghouse 的核能工程師，一邊撫養三個兒子，一邊還要設法維持生計。

So I think that was really important for us to see.

所以我覺得這對我們來說是很重要的一課。

Growing up and then my father having come from nowhere to come all the way up to the executive ranks, even during his career, he would make multiple steps, really high risk steps, leave his job, get another degree, bet on himself again and again, always with this kind of boundless optimism.

成長過程中，我爸爸白手起家，一路爬到高階主管的職位，即使在他職業生涯中，他也經歷了好幾次轉變，冒著很大的風險，辭掉工作，再唸一個學位，一次又一次地相信自己，總是抱持著這種無窮的樂觀。

And I think that carried through into me as well.

Yeah, I read somewhere that one of your key aims as a young man was just trying to fit in.

對，我讀到一篇文章說，你年輕時的一個主要目標就是努力融入。

You know, you're coming from an immigrant background as well.

Well, you know, I think it was, but we had a beautiful community there in Pittsburgh, actually.

嗯，你知道，我覺得有，但我們在匹茲堡有一個很棒的社群。

My parents helped found a temple there, the Srivankateswara Temple.

我的父母在那裡創辦了一間寺廟，就是 Srivankateswara Temple。

And I actually grew up, even though I was growing up in the United States, I grew up really grounded in Indian culture.

而且我其實是在美國長大的，但我從小就深受印度文化的影響。

Hinduism, books I now still quote, like the Bhagavad Gita were important in my upbringing.

印度教，還有像我現在還會引用的《薄伽梵歌》這類書籍，在我成長過程中都很重要。

So I always had a sense of belonging there.

所以，我一直覺得在那裡很有歸屬感。

But of course, at that time, there wasn't a large immigrant communities in these places where I was going to school.

但當然，在那個時候，我唸書的地方並沒有很大的移民社群。

You know, sometimes it was funny, I would only know the words for things and the language I learned first, which was Tamil, not English, and

你知道，有時候很有趣，我只會講我學的第一種語言，也就是坦米爾語，而不是英文，關於某些東西的說法，

always trying to catch myself when the kids would then laugh at me.

而且當孩子們笑我時，我總是要努力忍住。

You know, I think my parents instilled in me this, this idea by bringing me back to India many times in my, you particularly my mom, she would always take us back to say, you've had these extraordinary opportunities to get to the US to get an education.

其實，我覺得我父母透過帶我們回印度很多次，在我心中種下了這個想法，特別是我的媽媽，她總是會帶我們回去說，你們有這些非凡的機會來到美國接受教育。

像是，你如何運用你所獲得的機會來影響世界？

And going back and seeing that, of course, especially at that time in India, you would be seeing that there are millions, hundreds of millions of people without those opportunities.

回去看到那些，當然，尤其是在當時的印度，你會看到數百萬、數億人沒有這些機會。

And so always left with that thought that I've had the privilege to have these opportunities.

所以我總是帶著這個想法，我很有幸能擁有這些機會。

It's not a given, just the luck of the draw in many ways.

很多時候，這不是理所當然的，只是運氣好。

And then what can you do with that to make the world better.

然後你該如何運用這些來讓世界變得更好。

If you probably saw in the history, even in college, I went to Africa and I went to West Africa and I went to the Gambia.

如果你大概有看過歷史，甚至在大學時，我去過非洲，去了西非，去了甘比亞。

And probably it was that experience that more than any other, really instilled in me, this desire to pursue medicine and public health.

而大概是那段經歷，比任何其他經歷都更讓我內心深處，萌生了追求醫學和公共衛生的渴望。

Because you also looked at child poverty in India and you in Kolkata and other places, studying HIV treatments in Botswana.

因為你也看過印度的兒童貧困，以及你在加爾各答和其他地方，在波札那研究愛滋病治療。

Part of me can see how you could have gone down that route and stayed with people at medicine Sans Frontier and working in humanitarian relief, working in the charity sector as well.

我的一部分能理解你為何會選擇那條路，留在無國界醫生組織，從事人道救援工作，也在慈善領域工作。

I can easily have seen you going that way, given your resume.

考慮到你的履歷，我很容易想像你會走那條路。

Well, first, I want to make a call out there, you know, when you go back to Kolkata.

嗯，首先，我想在這裡說一下，你知道的，當你回到加爾各答。

That was actually the first trip my wife and I took, and

那其實是我和我太太第一次一起出國旅行，

we had only been dating for like, three months, and

那時候我們才交往大概三個月，

we ended up working with street children and child laborers in Calcutta together.

我們一起在加爾各答的街頭兒童和童工一起工作。

所以，你可以想像這是一個愛情故事。

That was like an interesting place to kind of.

那是一個很有趣的地方，可以讓你。

It was a crazy, crazy time then in Kolkata.

那時候在加爾各答真是瘋狂、瘋狂的時光。

But we managed and it was incredibly rewarding.

但我們撐過來了，而且這真的非常有成就感。

And then, as you said, to be part of the first HIV AIDS treatment effort in Africa and Botswana was extraordinary.

然後，就像你說的，能參與非洲波札那首次愛滋病治療的努力，真是太不平凡了。

But, you know, through those experiences, I also saw that in many of these, in many ways, management leadership was not very evolved in public health.

但是你知道，透過那些經驗，我也看到在很多地方，許多公共衛生領域的管理領導力還不是很成熟。

And so I think my first step into the business world was very much motivated by that desire to learn how to lead, learn how to make change happen at scale.

所以我想，我踏入商界的起步，很大程度上是受到那份渴望的驅使，想要學習如何領導、學習如何大規模地推動改變。

Because I think the history is that usually a great physician is just thrust into a leadership role without any of the experience.

因為我認為，歷史上通常都是很優秀的醫生，在沒有任何經驗的情況下就被推上領導職位。

And that's what I was observing on the ground.

這就是我在現場觀察到的情況。

So that's where the initial inclination came from.

所以最初的念頭就從那裡來了。

Now, I had no idea what ended up being a CEO.

那時候，我完全不知道後來會變成執行長。

It was always like, I'm going to go to business and come back to public health.

我一直覺得，我要去商界學習，然後再回到公共衛生領域。

然後，一件事接著一件事發生。

It's really interesting because more than one of my guests on this podcast, I always knew I was going to be a CEO.

這真的很有趣，因為在我這個 Podcast 的來賓中，不只一位，我一直都知道我會成為執行長。

I always knew that was the aspiration as well.

我一直都知道那也是我的目標。

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為何「奇怪」的職涯轉變，反而能帶來成長？諾華藥廠執行長 Vas Narasimhan 分享！ (Why ‘Strange’ Career Moves Often Lead to Growth — with Novartis CEO Vas Narasimhan)

absolutely

extraordinary

incredible

mindset