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  • (upbeat music)

  • - You have a book that is coming out that speaks

  • to a situation that we all find ourselves in right now

  • and that is we are isolated from people

  • that we know and love, many people are forced

  • to stay at home either by themselves

  • or not with the community they're used to.

  • You write in your book about how society is struggling

  • with a new disease and that is essentially loneliness.

  • What are some of the things people can do

  • to try and maintain their mental health

  • as well as their physical health?

  • - I'm so glad you asked, Trevor, because it's important

  • not just because loneliness makes us feel poorly,

  • but also because we now understand that chronic loneliness

  • is actually bad for our health.

  • It increases our risk for heart disease.

  • It's associated with a shorter life span.

  • But there are things that we can do

  • to ensure that we strengthen social connection.

  • And as hard as this time is,

  • I think that we can potentially come out of it

  • even stronger if we do a few things.

  • So number one, I think it's important that we spend

  • at least 15 minutes a day if not more engaged

  • with the people that we love,

  • whether that means video conferencing with them,

  • writing to them, calling them on the phone

  • so we can hear their voice.

  • The second is it's really important

  • that we make that time count.

  • And that means improving the quality of our time with others

  • by decreasing the distractions that we experience

  • during our interactions.

  • So instead of talking to somebody on the phone

  • while you're also scrolling through your social media feed

  • and refreshing your inbox and watching the news on TV,

  • just try talking to them with your full attention.

  • One of the greatest gifts that we can give people

  • is the gift of our full attention.

  • And finally, it's important also to recognize

  • that one of the back doors out of loneliness, if you will,

  • one of the great but hidden solutions to loneliness

  • is service.

  • It's by helping others that we actually take the focus off

  • of ourselves and place it on someone else.

  • It's how we rebuild a connection to someone

  • or establish a new one.

  • And it's also how we remind ourselves

  • that we have value to give to the world.

  • Because one of the great prices that we pay

  • when we're lonely is over time,

  • we start to buy into the idea that maybe we're lonely

  • because we're not likable.

  • Maybe in some way, it's our fault.

  • Maybe this is evidence of some personality flaw.

  • And none of that is true.

  • But when we serve other people, we're reminded

  • of how good it feels to connect

  • and that we have something of great value

  • to bring to them and to others around them.

  • (upbeat music)

  • - You delivered a TED Talk

  • where you predicted pretty much what is happening now.

  • Now, thanks to the world we live in, that has sprouted

  • a bunch of conspiracy theories, everything from Bill Gates

  • invented this virus to prove himself right

  • or he knew it was gonna happen and that's why he said it.

  • Was that TED Talk about this virus

  • or was that a hypothetical that has now come true?

  • - Well, I didn't know specifically that it'd be coronavirus

  • and that it would hit in late 2019, but the goal of the talk

  • was to encourage governments to make the investments

  • so we could respond very quickly

  • and keep the case numbers very, very low.

  • And so sadly, this is not a case where I feel like,

  • hey, I told you so.

  • Because we didn't use that time when it was clear

  • is the biggest threat to kill millions of people,

  • to have the diagnostic standing by,

  • to be ready to ramp up a vaccine factory.

  • A few things were done.

  • Some countries, our Foundation funded some work

  • that will help with the vaccines now,

  • will help with the diagnostics,

  • but most of what was called for particularly

  • in a New England Journal of Medicine article I did that went

  • into way more specifics than I could in a short TED Talk,

  • those things didn't get done

  • and so that's why it's taking us a long time

  • to get our act together faced with this threat.

  • - Here's a question I have as an individual.

  • How is it that you as a non government knew this information

  • and knew that it needed to be acted on and governments

  • and organizations that are specifically tasked

  • with protecting people from this very thing

  • either didn't have the information or ignored it?

  • What do you think happened there because I know you interact

  • with governments, you talk to organizations like the CDC,

  • like the WHO, what went wrong?

  • - Well, there are lots of individuals

  • who were as worried as I was, people like Dr. Fauci,

  • who'd been through various epidemics.

  • And so when we had Ebola, Zika, SARS, MERS,

  • we were lucky that they didn't transmit very easily.

  • They weren't these respiratory viruses where somebody

  • who's not very symptomatic and is still walking around

  • can spread the disease in some cases

  • to literally dozens of people.

  • So the respiratory transmission

  • particularly because world travel is so intense,

  • that's where I show the simulation in that speech

  • and say this keeps me up at night more than even war,

  • which is no small thing.

  • And yet, in terms of being systematic about,

  • okay, let's run a simulation and see how would we reach out

  • to the private sector for tests or ventilators

  • and what kind of quarantine would we do

  • and as we enter into this, we haven't practiced at all.

  • And so you can see it's every state is being forced

  • to figure things out on their own.

  • And it's very ad hoc.

  • It's not like when a war comes and we've done 20 simulations

  • of various types of threats and we've made sure

  • that the training communications logistics all those pieces

  • fall into place very rapidly.

  • - You were one of the first people to come out

  • and donate a large chunk of money to fighting coronavirus

  • or helping medical workers get the equipment they need.

  • I remember the last I read it was yourself and your wife,

  • Melinda, who had pledged over $100 million.

  • It seems though that money isn't able to fix this problem.

  • It seems like governments around the world

  • are trying everything they can,

  • but it doesn't seem like it can be fixed.

  • What are you hoping to achieve in this moment in time?

  • - Well, if we get the right testing capacity, you can change

  • by literally millions the number who are infected.

  • And governments will eventually come up

  • with lots of money for these things,

  • but they don't know where to direct it,

  • they can't move as quickly.

  • And so because our Foundation

  • has such deep expertise in infectious diseases,

  • we've thought about the epidemic, we did fund some things

  • to be more prepared, like a vaccine effort.

  • Our early money can accelerate things.

  • So for example, there's of all the vaccine constructs,

  • the seven most promising of those, even though we'll end up

  • picking at most two of them, we're gonna fund factories

  • for all seven.

  • And just so that we don't waste time in serially saying,

  • okay, which vaccine works and then building the factory.

  • Because to get to the best case that people like myself

  • and Dr. Fauci are seeing is about 18 months,

  • we need to do safety and efficacy and build manufacturing.

  • And they're different for the different constructs.

  • And so we'll abandon, it'll be a few billion dollars

  • we'll waste on manufacturing for the constructs

  • that don't get picked because something else is better.

  • But a few billion in this situation we're in

  • where there's trillions of dollars, that's 1,000 times more,

  • trillions of dollars being lost economically, it is worth it

  • in normal government procurement processes and understanding

  • which are the right seven, in a few months,

  • those may kick in.

  • But our Foundation, we can get that bootstrapped

  • and get it going and save months because every month counts.

  • Things can reopen if we do the right things in the summer,

  • but it won't be completely normal.

  • You'll still be very worried.

  • We may decide masks are important, although right now

  • they're in short supply for health workers

  • so people should not go and hoard those,

  • but the capacity of that can be brought up

  • so it may be something that like China today

  • everybody's walking around is wearing one of those.

  • So we'll have a lot of unusual measures

  • until we get the world vaccinated,

  • 7 billion people, that's a tall order.

  • But it is where we need to get to despite a lot of things

  • in between now and then to minimize the damage.

  • - You predicted this pandemic almost to a tee

  • and maybe it was because we were dealing with other things

  • at the time, we didn't really pay that much attention.

  • Is there anything else you wanna warn us about now

  • that we should be looking forward to,

  • is there anything else that keeps you up at night?

  • - Well, this is a naturally caused epidemic

  • and as bad as it is,

  • it looks if you have reasonable treatment

  • to have a 1% fatality.

  • There could be epidemics that are worse than that,

  • including ones that aren't naturally caused,

  • that are a form of bioterrorism.

  • But one thing I feel good about is this is such a big change

  • to the world that this time it won't be like Ebola,

  • which was just there in West Africa or Central Africa.

  • This time, the tens of billions

  • to have the diagnostics standing by,

  • the vaccine manufacturing standing by,

  • this time we will get ready for the next epidemic.

  • - Well, I hope your words are prophetic once again.

  • Thank you so much for your time.

  • Good luck in all of your work and stay healthy out there.

  • We need you.

  • (upbeat music)

  • Right now across America,

  • it seems like there's a huge divide

  • and there's a disconnect in understanding whether or not

  • the federal government should be stepping up

  • or whether or not states should be going at it alone.

  • We know that your state has been asking for supplies.

  • It sounds like your state is not getting the supplies

  • that it needs, but then there are states like Florida

  • where they've gotten 100% of what they've asked for

  • and they are nowhere near close to being in the situation

  • that your state is in.

  • Does it feel like there are politics at play with regards

  • to what relationship a state has with the president?

  • - Well, all I can say is this, you know,

  • the fact of the matter is it's on all of us

  • to remember that the enemy is the virus.

  • It's not one another.

  • It's not the federal government versus the states.

  • My experience is similar to that of a lot

  • of other governors, Republican and Democratic, frankly,

  • that we're not getting as much as we hoped to

  • from the federal government.

  • And so we've got to supplement that by contracting

  • with anyone we can buy masks from or test kits from.

  • And we're ending up bidding against one another

  • and it's really a destructive way about going

  • to fix this problem.

  • A national strategy with a national buying power

  • that actually ensured everyone had equitable access

  • to what we need when we need it would be the wisest thing

  • to do, but we're in this situation

  • and like governors across this country,

  • I'm gonna do everything I can.

  • So whether it is working with businesses inside Michigan,

  • like the Big Three who are stepping up

  • to start producing components to ventilators,

  • we're gonna see the arsenal of innovation

  • is gonna be right here within our borders,

  • but we've got a lot of work to do.

  • The unfortunate thing is our need is right now.

  • We have a need for not just PPE, but for volunteers.

  • We're looking for people to come into Michigan

  • and help us meet our need.

  • And any of your viewers who are interested in that

  • can go to michigan.gov/fightcovid19

  • and join the fight with us

  • because it's gotta be all hands on deck

  • and we are a hotspot right now.

  • - It's hard to talk with you or speak with you

  • and not ask you about the comments

  • the president made about you.

  • I think you have a shirt that might be exactly that.

  • That woman from Michigan, an extremely dismissive statement

  • and one that sparked a conversation across the country

  • where Trump flat out said if you are not nice to him,

  • he will not help you.

  • I believe that Vice President Mike Pence still called you.

  • Is it difficult for you during this period

  • to be dealing with politics whilst at the same time trying

  • to deal with a crisis?

  • - I don't think any of us has energy

  • to deal with politics right now.

  • All of our energy, all of our focus has to be

  • on meeting the needs of our people.

  • People are dying.

  • Every day we are announcing the additional people

  • that have tested positive for COVID-19,

  • the number of lives that are lost.

  • Those are stories, those are people

  • who leave loved ones and family.

  • Those are people who relied on a health care system

  • to meet their needs and frontline providers

  • who put their own health at risk to take care of others.

  • I don't have any time to think about fighting anything other

  • than COVID-19 and that's precisely why I say

  • let's not fight one another.

  • We are not the enemy, this virus is.

  • (upbeat music)

  • - You are an infectious diseases expert

  • who has advised six presidents on everything

  • from SARS to Ebola to the HIV epidemic and Zika.

  • I have four questions

  • because I know we're gonna run out of time,

  • but I just wanna let you know I have four questions

  • that I think are really important.

  • Number one, we hear about this clock,

  • 15 days where things will be reassessed,

  • 15 days where people might go back,

  • 15 days, every country, 21 days.

  • There seems to be a clock.

  • My question is what is that clock supposed to be

  • and is there a certain amount of time that people can be

  • away from each other where coronavirus goes away

  • and the follow up in that same question is

  • does the clock start

  • if people are not completely quarantined during that period?

  • - Yeah, the virus is the clock, Trevor.

  • So people say arbitrarily,

  • well in two weeks, we're gonna be okay.

  • It depends on the kinetics of the outbreak.

  • Right now, take New York City.

  • They are getting hit really hard

  • and the kinetics of the outbreak is going there.

  • You can't predict when it'll make that turnaround

  • and start coming down.

  • In general, if you look historically at countries

  • that have been through the whole cycle.

  • In China, it was about eight weeks or so

  • before it went way up and then way down.

  • In Korea, the same thing.

  • So if you look at each individual country

  • and being a big country as we are here in the United States,

  • we're almost like a lot of little countries.

  • New York in itself could be considered a country,

  • California could be considered a country.

  • So it's unpredictable about when you can say this cycle,

  • it's usually measured in several weeks.

  • Sometimes when you're into the cycle, you may only be two

  • to three weeks away before it starts to turn around.

  • - Right, okay, so then to that point,

  • that's then my second of the four questions.

  • Second question is is New York City really harder hit

  • or is New York's testing making the numbers spike up

  • and is this something that we're going to see

  • start trending throughout America?

  • - Well, there are a couple of good questions right in there.

  • New York is more hardly hit for sure.

  • The nature of the city, the crowding of the city,

  • the fact that you get the beginning of your outbreak

  • when you get influx from other countries.

  • China was the index country that came in.

  • New York is a travel hub of the country.

  • So clearly we had a lot of cases come in.

  • By the time they realized what they were dealing with,

  • they had already gotten a sucker punch.

  • And they really were playing catch up.

  • They didn't do anything wrong, they're not very different

  • except that they're a big robust city

  • and because of that, they're getting hit hard.

  • - Okay, and then this second last question is

  • with regards to reinfection and immunity.

  • We talk about people who have it and are asymptomatic.

  • We talk about people who are recovering and we're starting

  • to see those numbers grow around the world.

  • Do we know yet if getting corona and surviving corona means

  • that you're now immune to the disease

  • or is there a chance of reinfection?

  • - We don't know that for 100% certain

  • 'cause we haven't done the study to see rechallenges,

  • whether they've been protected.

  • But I feel really confident that if this virus acts like

  • every other virus that we know, once you get infected,

  • get better, clear the virus that you'll have immunity

  • that will protect you against reinfection.

  • So it's never 100%, but I'd be willing to bet anything

  • that people who recover

  • are really protected against reinfection.

  • - Okay, and then our finally question,

  • and thank you so much for your time.

  • I really hope everyone understands how important it is

  • to listen to you.

  • Final question with regards to the government, the CDC,

  • the NIH and all of the units working together, right now

  • it feels like there is a push and pull, a tug of war

  • between states and the federal government, et cetera.

  • For Americans who are out there watching this,

  • what is the plan and what do you think needs to happen

  • for the whole unit of the United States

  • to fight the coronavirus implementing different checks

  • and balances along the way to make sure

  • that everyone fights it and the numbers go down?

  • - Well, that's a very good question.

  • Things are implemented at the state and local level.

  • That's the way this country works so well.

  • The federal government is a facilitator, it's a supplier,

  • it's a supporter and that's the way things should be going

  • and that's what we're starting to see now

  • as we are catching up on things

  • that weren't done so well in the beginning.

  • We now have many, many more tests.

  • The private industry is getting involved.

  • The government's not making the tests,

  • the private industry is.

  • The ventilators that are needed coming out of the stockpile,

  • yet companies are starting to make more.

  • So what really is a marriage between the federal government

  • as the facilitator and supporter of where the real action is

  • is at the state and local level.

  • - Thank you so much, Dr. Fauci, you've been amazing.

  • I could talk to you for an hour on this,

  • but I know everyone wants your time.

  • Good luck with what you're doing

  • and I hope we're doing our part

  • to make your job a little bit easier, thank you.

  • - You are very much and I appreciate the opportunity

  • to speak with you.

  • - Stay safe and wash your hands

  • because of that fake cough you did.

  • (laughing)

  • - Take care.

  • (upbeat music)

  • - One of the most confusing conversations

  • happening right now in America is the battle

  • between governors/states

  • and the president/the federal government.

  • In your opinion, where is the federal government

  • falling short and where do you think states need to step up

  • and do more to fight this pandemic?

  • - We have not received any ventilators

  • in a state of 40 million to meet our needs.

  • There were 170 ventilators that went directly to LA County.

  • Just a couple days ago, they opened the boxes

  • and found out that none of them worked.

  • So rather than complaining about it,

  • we decided to ship them from LA.

  • I brought them into Silicon Valley

  • and literally within 72 hours, all of them were fixed

  • and they've already been sent back down to Los Angeles.

  • It's a way of making this point and answering your question,

  • we're not waiting around for the federal government,

  • we need more support, but at the end of the day, we have

  • to be resourceful in our mindset and our approach

  • and use all the tools in our toolkit.

  • All of that being said, I wanna thank the president

  • in this respect.

  • We got that USNS Mercy, that large hospital ship,

  • 1,000-bed capacity into LA a couple days ago.

  • And that's the kind of thing we do count

  • on the federal government for.

  • Beyond that, we're gonna be as resourceful as we can be.

  • - One of the things you were given credit for is being one

  • of the governors who acted earliest

  • with regards to the coronavirus.

  • You told people over 65 to stay at home.

  • You then implemented a lockdown

  • before many other states did,

  • you've still come out and said you were worried

  • that up to 25 million Californians/Americans

  • could get the coronavirus.

  • How do you think you are looking right now?

  • Do those numbers still look as dire

  • or do you think that you've done enough

  • to stave off the pandemic from growing?

  • - Well, good enough never is.

  • You don't run the 90-yard dash on this.

  • And I think the biggest mistake we can make

  • is having done all of this good work,

  • the stay-at-home orders,

  • having people practice safe physical distancing,

  • I prefer physical distancing to social distancing

  • 'cause a lot of young folks are confused

  • by social distancing when they're all socially connected,

  • but we need them physically apart.

  • The fact that we're practicing that at scale, we think

  • has a bought us time, but we're not out of this

  • by any stretch of the imagination.

  • Let me be specific, in just the last four days,

  • we have tripled the number of people in our ICUs,

  • we've doubled in the last four days the number of people

  • in our hospital system,

  • but we do believe that early call on stay at home

  • and physical distancing bought us a few days, maybe a week

  • or two that allowed us to start getting our resources

  • in place to meet the moment.

  • - Before we go, is there anything

  • you would like the public to do?

  • Is there anything people can help officials with?

  • Because we always ask from the top down,

  • but what can we be doing to help in this situation?

  • - There's nothing more potent and powerful

  • and the tool at hand for every single person watching

  • and that's practicing physical distancing.

  • Not going to the beach or playgrounds or parks when tons

  • of other people are out there, not going out on a jog

  • when those jogging paths are full.

  • If we do that there's nothing more significant

  • to bend the curve, and that's heroic.

  • Everybody has the capacity.

  • It's decisions, decisions, not conditions

  • that can determine the fate of this virus.

  • And so when you're reading all of these programs

  • and are watching programs

  • that say here's what's going to happen, that's nonsense.

  • Nothing is predetermined.

  • We have the capacity to bend the curve

  • by making better decisions.

  • And so please practice physical distancing

  • and don't buy for a second that we can cut the parachute

  • before we've landed.

  • - Governor Newsom, thank you very much for your time.

  • Good luck out there.

  • (upbeat music)

(upbeat music)

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