And we're all talking about this great English icon and saying,

所以, 我就被要求去拍攝這電影: 伊莉莎白女王

"She's a fantastic woman, she does everything.

接著, 我們談著這個英國代表性人物, 說著:

How are we going to introduce her?"

她真是一個了不起的女人, 她做了許多事

So we went around the table with the studio and the producers and the writer,

我們應該怎樣去介紹她呢?

and they came to me and said, "Shekhar, what do you think?"

於是, 我們一群人, 包括編劇, 監製, 圍著拍攝廠的大枱踱步盤算著

And I said, "I think she's dancing."

跟著, 他們走過來跟我說: 謝加, 你認為怎樣?

And I could see everybody looked at me,

我說: 我想她應該在跳舞

somebody said, "Bollywood."

我看到所有人都望著我

The other said, "How much did we hire him for?"

有人說: 寶萊塢的電影人

And the third said, "Let's find another director."

另一個人說: 我們出了多少錢請他?

I thought I had better change.

第三個說: 不如我們另外找個導演吧

So we had a lot of discussion on how to introduce Elizabeth,

我在想, 也許我應該改變

and I said, "OK, maybe I am too Bollywood.

於是, 我們仍繼續討論怎樣去介紹伊莉莎白

Maybe Elizabeth, this great icon, dancing?

跟著我說, 好吧, 或許我還是太印度式吧

What are you talking about?"

但伊莉莎白, 這個偉大的人物, 或許仍可跳舞吧?

So I rethought the whole thing,

你在說些什麼?

and then we all came to a consensus.

於是, 我再重新思考這件事

And here was the introduction of this

最後, 我們全部都達成了協議

great British icon called "Elizabeth."

而這就是, 英國偉大的代表性人物,

Leicester: May I join you, my lady?

名叫: 伊莉莎白的出場介紹

Elizabeth: If it please you, sir.

箂斯特: 我的女士, 我可以跟你一起嗎?

(Music)

伊莉莎白:先生, 如果你喜歡的話

Shekhar Kapur: So she was dancing.

音樂

So how many people who saw the film did not get

謝加. 凱普爾: 於是, 她在跳舞

that here was a woman in love,

有多少人看過這電影, 會感受不到

that she was completely innocent

這女士墜入愛河

and saw great joy in her life, and she was youthful?

她是如此的純真

And how many of you did not get that?

讓人看到她生命裡的快樂, 還有她的青春

That's the power of visual storytelling,

你們有多少人不會看到這些?

that's the power of dance, that's the power of music:

這就是用影像來說故事的力量

the power of not knowing.

這是舞蹈的力量, 這是音樂的力量

When I go out to direct a film,

還是, 「不知道」的力量

every day we prepare too much, we think too much.

當我開始去導一齣電影

Knowledge becomes a weight upon wisdom.

通常我們都會準備得太多, 想得太多

You know, simple words lost

但知識有時會變成智慧的負擔

in the quicksand of experience.

你知, 在快速流轉的經驗之中

So I come up, and I say,

簡單的言詞便會失去

"What am I going to do today?" I'm not going to do what I planned to do,

於是, 我走出來, 我說

and I put myself into absolute panic.

「我今天要做什麼事?」, 我今天不準備做我計劃了的事

It's my one way of getting rid of my mind,

於是, 我把自己放置在一個絕對恐慌的狀態裡

getting rid of this mind that says,

這是一種掏空自己的方法

"Hey, you know what you're doing. You know exactly what you're doing.

掏空自己的意思是

You're a director, you've done it for years."

「喂, 你知道你應該怎做, 你知道很清楚自己該怎做

So I've got to get there

你是一個導演, 你做了導演許多年」

and be in complete panic.

於是我到了那個空白的狀態

It's a symbolic gesture. I tear up the script,

也變成了非常的恐懼

I go and I panic myself, I get scared.

加上一個很有象徵意義的姿態, 我會撕掉手上的劇本

I'm doing it right now; you can watch me. I'm getting nervous,

我繼續, 讓自己變得恐慌。我很驚

I don't know what to say, I don't know what I'm doing, I don't want to go there.

我現在就做著, 你看看我, 我很緊張呢

And as I go there, of course, my A.D. says,

我不知道要說什麼, 我不知道我在做什麼, 我不知要到那裡去

"You know what you're going to do, sir." I say, "Of course I do."

我到了那裡, 當然, 我的副導演說:

And the studio executives, they would say,

「先生, 你知道自己打算怎樣做.」 我說, 「當然, 我知道」

"Hey, look at Shekhar. He's so prepared."

跟著, 攝影廠的管事人會說

And inside I've just been listening to Nusrat Fateh Ali Khan

「你看, 謝加, 他是如此的有備而來。」

because he's chaotic.

可是, 在我的裡面, 我聽到一些聲音

I'm allowing myself to go into chaos

因為他現在一片混亂

because out of chaos, I'm hoping some moments of truth will come.

我容讓我自己走進這種混亂之中

All preparation is preparation.

因為在混亂中, 我在期待著一些真理的時刻會來臨

I don't even know if it's honest.

所有的準備就是準備

I don't even know if it's truthful.

我甚至不知道這是否誠實

The truth of it all comes on the moment, organically,

我也不知道這是否真實

and if you get five great moments

真相有時只在那一剎那間出現, 有生命的

of great, organic stuff

如果你在那些偉大的, 有感染力的東西之中

in your storytelling, in your film,

有五個偉大的時刻

your film, audiences will get it.

在你的故事, 在你的電影裡

So I'm looking for those moments, and I'm standing there

你的電影觀眾會感受得到它的

and saying, "I don't know what to say."

我為了尋找那樣的時刻, 我站在那裡

So, ultimately, everybody's looking at you,

說著 : 『我不知要說什麼。』

200 people at seven in the morning

最後, 每個人都看著你

who got there at quarter to seven, and you arrived at seven,

早上七時, 有二百人

and everybody's saying,

在六時四十五分已經到了, 而你在七時出現

"Hey. What's the first thing? What's going to happen?"

每個人都說

And you put yourself into a state of panic

「喂, 什麼是第一件要做的事? 跟著有些什麼會發生?」

where you don't know, and so you don't know.

而你, 卻把你自己放在那恐慌的處境裡

And so, because you don't know,

你連自己在那裡也不知道, 所以你不知道

you're praying to the universe because you're praying to the universe

就是這樣, 因為你不知道

that something -- I'm going to try and access the universe

你向天地祈禱, 因為你向天地祈禱,

the way Einstein -- say a prayer --

這樣的, 我便嘗試走進了天地之中

accessed his equations,

就好像愛因斯坦那樣的---誠心祈禱

the same source. I'm looking for the same source

去到--- 他的方程式

because creativity comes from absolutely the same source

同一個源頭, 我在尋找同一個源頭

that you meditate somewhere outside yourself,

因為創造力其實是來自同一個源頭

outside the universe.

那裡, 你好像在自身之外默想

You're looking for something that comes and hits you.

在天地之外

Until that hits you, you're not going to do the first shot.

你在找著一些會來走過來觸動你的東西

So what do you do?

直等到這一刻的觸動, 否則, 你實在不會開始第一個鏡頭

So Cate says, "Shekhar, what do you want me to do?"

所以, 你可以做些什麼？

And I say, "Cate, what do you want to do?" (Laughter)

就正如凱特所說: 「謝加, 你想我怎樣做?」

"You're a great actor, and I like to give to my actors --

跟著我說: 「凱特, 你想我怎樣做?」 (笑聲)

why don't you show me what you want to do?"

「你是一個偉大的演員, 我喜歡我的演員能自我發揮

(Laughter)

為什麼你不展示給我看你想怎樣做」

What am I doing? I'm trying to buy time.

笑聲

I'm trying to buy time.

我在做什麼? 其實我想去拖延時間

So the first thing about storytelling that I learned,

我嘗試去拖延時間

and I follow all the time is: Panic.

這是我學懂講故事的第一件事

Panic is the great access of creativity

我接下來的時間, 仍是---恐慌

because that's the only way to get rid of your mind.

恐慌就是開啟我創作力的鑰匙

Get rid of your mind.

因為這是唯一的方式, 讓你去清空你自己

Get out of it, get it out.

清空自己的思想

And let's go to the universe because

掏空自己, 清淨自己

there's something out there that is more

讓我們一起走進宇宙的天地, 因為

truthful than your mind,

那裡存著有些比起你的思想

that is more truthful than your universe.

更真實的東西

[unclear], you said that yesterday. I'm just repeating it

比起你的宇宙更真實的存在

because that's what I follow constantly

你昨天說, 我現在只在覆述

to find the shunyata somewhere, the emptiness.

因為這是我一直跟隨

Out of the emptiness comes a moment of creativity.

去那在某處的空性, 那虛空的感覺

So that's what I do.

那刻的創造力就是存在於虛空之中

When I was a kid -- I was about eight years old.

這就是我的做法

You remember how India was. There was no pollution.

當我還是小孩---大約八歲的時候

In Delhi, we used to live -- we used to call it a chhat or the khota.

你也許會想起印度是怎樣的, 那裡沒有汚染

Khota's now become a bad word. It means their terrace --

在德里, 我們以前住的地方---- 我們曾經叫它chata 或是khota.

and we used to sleep out at night.

Khota現在變成了一句壞話, 意思是他們的陽台

At school I was being just taught about physics,

我們以前通常會在街上睡覺

and I was told that

在學校, 我們會學到物理

if there is something that exists,

於是, 我就是被教導

then it is measurable.

假如有些東西是真實存在的

If it is not measurable,

它是可以量度的

it does not exist.

假如它是不可以量度的

And at night I would lie out, looking at the unpolluted sky,

它便不是存在的

as Delhi used to be at that time when I was a kid,

那一個晚上, 我睡在沒有汚染的天空下

and I used to stare at the universe and say,

以前德里常常是這樣的, 當我還是孩子的時候

"How far does this universe go?"

我想會凝視著宇宙, 然後說

My father was a doctor.

「這個宇宙走了多遠?」

And I would think, "Daddy, how far does the universe go?"

我的爸爸是一個醫生

And he said, "Son, it goes on forever."

我會問: 「爸爸, 宇宙走了多遠?」

So I said, "Please measure forever

他說, 「兒子, 宇宙是永遠的走下去的」

because in school they're teaching me

我說: 「請量度永遠

that if I cannot measure it, it does not exist.

因為學校的老師教我

It doesn't come into my frame of reference."

假如我不能够量度它, 它便不是存在的

So, how far does eternity go?

它便不是在我的理解範圍之內的了」

What does forever mean?

所以, 究竟永恒可以走多遠

And I would lie there crying at night

永遠是什麼的意思

because my imagination could not touch creativity.

於是, 我便會在夜裡躺著哭

So what did I do?

因為我的想像力不能接觸到那樣的創造力

At that time, at the tender age of seven,

我可以做些什麼呢?

I created a story.

在那時, 一個幼小的七歲孩子

What was my story?

我創造了一個故事

And I don't know why, but I remember the story.

什麼是我的故事?

There was a woodcutter

我不知道為什麼, 但我記得那故事

who's about to take his ax and chop a piece of wood,

那裡有一個樵夫

and the whole galaxy is one atom of that ax.

他準備去用他的斧刀砍開一塊木頭

And when that ax hits that piece of wood,

整個星球, 就是那樵夫手上斧刀上的一粒原子

that's when everything will destroy

而當斧刀砍進木頭的時候

and the Big Bang will happen again.

所有的東西都會被毀滅

But all before that there was a woodcutter.

巨大的爆炸便會發生

And then when I would run out of that story,

可是回到一切之前, 這只是一個樵夫

I would imagine that woodcutter's universe

接著, 當我走出這故事之外

is one atom in the ax of another woodcutter.

我想像這樵夫的宇宙

So every time, I could tell my story again and again

也是一粒原子, 其實就是另一個樵夫手持的那斧刀的其中一粒原子

and get over this problem,

所以每一次, 我都可以重覆的去講說我的故事

and so I got over the problem.

跟著便處理了這個問題

How did I do it? Tell a story.

於是, 我便解決了這問題

So what is a story?

我怎樣做成的? 講故事

A story is our -- all of us --

什麼是故事?

we are the stories we tell ourselves.

故事是我們的 --- 所有的我們

In this universe, and this existence,

我們就是說給自己聽的故事

where we live with this duality

在這個宇宙, 在這個存有

of whether we exist or not

我們是跟這個二元性共存的

and who are we,

其一是, 我們究竟有沒有存在

the stories we tell ourselves are the stories

以及, 我們是誰

that define the potentialities

那些我們告訴自己的故事, 是故事

of our existence.

當中定義了我們存在的

We are the stories we tell ourselves.

可能性

So that's as wide as we look at stories.

我們是我們說給自己聽的故事

A story is the relationship

就好像我們看著故事一樣的

that you develop between who you are,

一個故事是一份關係

or who you potentially are,

是你跟你是誰所建立的關係

and the infinite world, and that's our mythology.

或是你跟你可能是誰之間所建立的關係

We tell our stories,

以及那個無限之間的關係, 這就是我的神話

and a person without a story does not exist.

我們講述自己的故事

So Einstein told a story

一個沒有故事的人, 是不存在的

and followed his stories and came up with theories

所以愛因斯坦講了一個故事

and came up with theories and then came up with his equations.

隨著他的故事, 出現了他的理論

Alexander had a story that his mother used to tell him,

有了理論, 便有了他的方程式

and he went out to conquer the world.

亞歷山大有一個他媽媽告訴他的故事

We all, everybody, has a story that they follow.

所以他走出去統治了全世界

We tell ourselves stories.

我們所有人, 每一個人, 都有一個我們跟隨的故事

So, I will go further, and I say,

我們告訴自己故事

"I tell a story, and therefore I exist."

所以, 接下去, 我會說

I exist because there are stories,

我講一個故事, 所以我存在

and if there are no stories, we don't exist.

我存在, 因為這裡有故事

We create stories to define our existence.

如果這裡沒有故事, 我們並不存在

If we do not create the stories,

我們創造故事去解說自己的存在

we probably go mad.

如果我們沒有創造這些故事

I don't know; I'm not sure, but that's what I've done all the time.

也許我們會發瘋

Now, a film.

我不知道, 我不太肯定, 但我卻常常會做的

A film tells a story.

現在, 一齣電影

I often wonder when I make a film -- I'm thinking of making a film of the Buddha --

電影講故事

and I often wonder: If Buddha had all the elements

當我拍電影的時候, 我常想弄清楚 --- 我正在想拍一齣有關佛陀的電影

that are given to a director --

我常常懷疑, 假如佛陀把所有的元素

if he had music, if he had visuals, if he had a video camera --

都給了導演

would we get Buddhism better?

假如他有音樂, 假如他有影像, 假如他有攝影機

But that puts some kind of burden on me.

我們會不會更能領受佛教的教義

I have to tell a story

但這樣想法卻讓我有負擔

in a much more elaborate way,

我要講;一個故事

but I have the potential.

用一種更詳盡的方法

It's called subtext.

但我有這樣的潛質

When I first went to Hollywood, they said --

這叫做潛台詞

I used to talk about subtext, and my agent came to me,

當我第一次跑到好箂塢, 他們說

"Would you kindly not talk about subtext?"

我常說到潛台詞, 我的經理人告訴我

And I said, "Why?" He said, "Because nobody is going to give you a film

你是否可以不再講潛台詞

if you talk about subtext.

我問: 「為什麼? 」他說:「 因為這裡沒有人會給你一齣電影

Just talk about plot

如果你要說潛台詞

and say how wonderful you'll shoot the film,

你就說有關劇本

what the visuals will be."

同時說你會怎樣把電影拍得很好

So when I look at a film,

那些畫面怎樣」

here's what we look for:

所以當我看一齣電影

We look for a story on the plot level,

這就是我們想要看到的東西

then we look for a story

我們想看到劇情裡的故事

on the psychological level,

接著我們會想看到故事裡

then we look for a story on the political level,

的心理層面

then we look at a story

我們跟著也想看到故事的政治層面

on a mythological level.

然後, 我們又會想看到故事裡

And I look for stories on each level.

神話部份

Now, it is not necessary

其實我是想看到故事裡的每一個不同層面

that these stories agree with each other.

現在, 但故事之間卻不一定必然

What is wonderful is,

的會調合起來

at many times, the stories will contradict with each other.

最奇妙的是

So when I work with Rahman who's a great musician,

在許多的時候, 故事會互相矛盾起來

I often tell him, "Don't follow what the script already says.

所以, 當我跟偉大的音樂家拉赫曼合作的時候

Find that which is not.

我常告訴他: 「不要跟隨著劇本已經說了的部份

Find the truth for yourself,

去找劇本沒有說的部份

and when you find the truth for yourself,

去找你自己內裡的真實

there will be a truth in it, but it may contradict the plot,

當你能够找到你自己的真實

but don't worry about it."

這就是一個故事裡的真實, 但它可能會跟劇情違背

So, the sequel to "Elizabeth," "Golden Age."

但不用擔心」

When I made the sequel to "Elizabeth," here was a story that

所以, 伊莉莎白的續集 ---黃金歲月

the writer was telling:

當我在準備拍伊莉莎白的續集時, 這裡已經有一個

A woman who was threatened

編劇寫了的故事

by Philip II

一個被菲臘二世威脅

and was going to war,

的女人

and was going to war, fell in love with Walter Raleigh.

她準備去打仗

Because she fell in love with Walter Raleigh,

就在準備去打扙的時候, 跟雷利墮入了愛河

she was giving up the reasons she was a queen,

就是因為她愛上了雷利

and then Walter Raleigh

她放棄了當一個女皇的憑藉

fell in love with her lady in waiting,

跟著瓦爾特. 雷利

and she had to decide whether she was a queen going to war

愛上了女王的宮女

or she wanted...

於是, 她需要決定究竟她需要去準備打仗