where we gathered the creative powerhouses behind

在這裡，我們聚集了在 "中國 "的背後有創意的力量。

your favorite Disney+ movies and series together for a real,

你最喜歡的迪斯尼+電影和系列，一起做一個真正的。

no-holds-barred conversation about identity,

關於身份的無障礙對話。

community, and driving social change through storytelling.

社區，並通過講故事推動社會變革。

I'm your host, Brea Baker.

我是你們的主持人，佈雷亞-貝克。

I'm so excited to be joined by some of the brilliant talent

我很高興能與一些傑出的人才一起工作。

from Walt Disney Animation Studios, who recently worked

來自沃爾特-迪斯尼動畫工作室，最近工作的是

on "Raya and the Last Dragon."

關於 "拉亞和最後的龍"。

Today, we're going to be talking about what it means to be first-

今天，我們將討論什麼是第一------。

and second-generation American.

和第二代美國人。

I was made fun of at school.

我在學校被人取笑。

I purposely stopped speaking Arabic.

我特意不再說阿拉伯語。

My peers that weren't Asian, obviously,

我那些不是亞洲人的同齡人，顯然。

would remind me that I was Asian.

會提醒我，我是亞洲人。

When you do have people behind the camera

當你確實有人在攝影機後面

telling the stories that are authentic to them,

講述對他們來說是真實的故事。

it shines through.

它閃閃發光。

[MUSIC PLAYING]

[音樂響起]

BREA BAKER: Hi, everyone.

BREA BAKER：大家好。

I'm so excited to get into this conversation, because today,

我很高興能進入這個對話，因為今天。

we're going to talk about what it means to be first-

我們將討論什麼是第一個......。

or second-generation American, how that's impacted each of you

或第二代美國人，這對你們每個人的影響如何？

personally, and also how it's shaped and inspired

親自，以及它是如何塑造和啟發的

you as storytellers.

你們是講故事的人。

I just want to start by asking, what

我只想先問，什麼

does it feel like to have made something

創作的感覺是什麼呢？

that means so much to people?

這對人們來說意味著什麼？

I'm so grateful that I was a part of the film.

我非常感謝我參與了這部電影。

And it was incredible to send a message of hope and unity

而發出一個希望和團結的資訊是不可思議的

in order to build something bigger than oneself.

為了建立比自己更大的東西。

I had the privilege of growing up in many different places

我有幸在許多不同的地方成長起來

and seeing different cultures.

並看到不同的文化。

So that aspect of "Raya," of all these cultures

是以，"拉雅 "的這一方面，所有這些文化的

coming together as one, was something that I feel like was

團結一致，是我覺得的事情。

something personal to myself.

屬於我個人的東西。

Definitely.

絕對的。

I mean, and as the writer, this has to be a dream come true.

我的意思是，作為作家，這必須是一個夢想成真。

It's a thing that I always wanted to give my kids,

這是我一直想給我孩子的東西。

an opportunity to look up at the screen and see a hero that

有機會抬頭看螢幕，看到一個英雄。

looks like them, that they could put on a cape and a hat

看起來像他們，他們可以穿上披風和帽子

and a sword and feel like they could save the world.

和一把劍，感覺他們可以拯救世界。

'Cause it makes "Raya" such an incredible

因為它使 "Raya "成為一個令人難以置信的

thing that even exists,

甚至存在的東西。

but to be part of it is a dream beyond something

但要成為它的一部分，是一個超越東西的夢想。

I could have ever hoped for.

我曾經希望的。

When I first told my parents I wanted

當我第一次告訴我的父母我想

to be an animator, first thing they responded with was,

成為一名動畫師，他們迴應的第一件事就是。

what's an animator?

什麼是動畫師？

Coming from Cuba into the States,

從古巴進入美國。

they really didn't understand all the careers

他們真的不瞭解所有的職業

that you could possibly have.

你可能擁有的。

So when I told them that my dream was

所以當我告訴他們，我的夢想是

to really work in films and tell stories,

真正在電影中工作，講故事。

they were excited for me.

他們為我感到興奮。

They just didn't understand how you got there.

他們只是不明白你是如何到達那裡的。

And neither did I, to be honest.

說實話，我也沒有。

Now that I've brought my parents into the studio,

現在我把我的父母帶到了工作室。

and I've been able to show them the process of animation

我已經能夠向他們展示動畫的過程。

and how we create performances that then you

以及我們如何創造表演，然後你

can see in the movies, they have a better understanding

在電影中可以看到，他們有一個更好的理解

of what it is I do every day.

我每天都在做什麼。

It's been really incredible and rewarding,

這真的很令人難以置信，也很有意義。

as a first-generation Cuban American,

作為第一代古巴裔美國人。

to be able to share with them the success behind the films

能夠與他們分享電影背後的成功。

that I've made and seeing them be so proud of me.

我所做的一切，看到他們為我感到如此驕傲。

So let's jump right in.

是以，讓我們直接跳進去。

These words mean so many different things

這些詞有許多不同的含義

to different people, based on where we come from.

對不同的人來說，基於我們來自哪裡。

So I think it's best to start with the basics of,

是以，我認為最好從基礎知識開始。

how do you each identify, as either first-

你們各自如何確定，作為第一--

or second-generation American, and what has

或第二代美國人，以及有什麼

that experience meant to you?

這段經歷對你意味著什麼？

I guess, in technical terms, I would consider myself

我想，從技術角度看，我認為自己

first-generation American because I was born in Egypt,

我是第一代美國人，因為我出生在埃及。

and then I immigrated away from there.

然後我移民離開了那裡。

Same with my parents.

我的父母也一樣。

But in some ways, I consider myself second-generation

但在某些方面，我認為自己是第二代

just because I've spent most of my life in the West,

只是因為我的大部分時間都是在西方度過的。

whereas my parents spent most of their life in Egypt.

而我的父母在埃及度過了他們的大部分生活。

And the cultural divide that we have between each other

而我們彼此之間的文化鴻溝

is so vast that I kind of differentiate the

是如此的龐大，以至於我有點區分了

cultural generations that way.

這樣的文化世代。

That's interesting because I actually consider myself

這很有趣，因為我實際上認為自己

first-generation, even though my parents were born in Cuba,

我是第一代，儘管我的父母出生在古巴。

and then they immigrated here.

然後他們移民到這裡。

Now I'm looking at it differently.

現在我以不同的方式看待它。

I would consider myself a second-generation and my parents

我認為自己是第二代，我的父母是第二代。

first-generation.

第一代。

I mean, I was born here.

我的意思是，我在這裡出生。

My parents are refugees.

我的父母是難民。

And so I think I'm like Rebecca.

所以我覺得我就像麗貝卡一樣。

It's always the generational thing.

這總是一代人的事情。

I was like, I always thought I was first-generation, 'cause

我當時想，我一直以為我是第一代，因為

they were refugees, and I was the first-generation American

他們是難民，而我是第一代美國人。

in the family.

在家庭中。

But I guess, by Yasser's definition,

但我想，按照亞瑟的定義。

I'm a second-generation American.

我是第二代美國人。

The thing that I think defines it the most for me is being,

我認為對我來說，最能定義它的事情是存在。

like, in between cultures, right?

像，在文化之間，對嗎？

Like, for my parents, they are definitely Vietnamese.

比如，對我的父母來說，他們絕對是越南人。

And there's obviously a cultural separation between me

而我和他之間顯然存在著文化上的隔閡。

and them in that way, even though they're my parents

和他們在一起，儘管他們是我的父母

and I love them.

而且我喜歡他們。

But then I also don't fit in completely.

但是，我也不完全適合。

I grew up in southern Arkansas, and

我在阿肯色州南部長大，和

so I was always reminded that I didn't

所以我總是被提醒，我沒有

look like everybody else.

看起來像其他人一樣。

So I was kind of like an in-between American,

是以，我有點像一個介於兩者之間的美國人。

in that sense, you know, 'cause my peers that weren't Asian,

在這個意義上，你知道，因為我的同齡人不是亞洲人。

obviously, would remind me that I was Asian,

顯然，這將提醒我，我是亞洲人。

or Vietnamese specifically.

或特別是越南人。

And then my parents were always like, oh,

然後我的父母總是說，哦。

you're so not like us.

你和我們不一樣。

You're totally American.

你完全是美國人。

By living in that middle place is where I think myself

通過生活在這個中間的地方，我認為我自己

and a lot of children of immigrants have grown up in.

和很多移民的孩子都在其中長大。

A lot of us don't neatly fit into categories.

我們中的很多人都不能整齊地歸為一類。

Yeah, that's so true.

是的，這太對了。

On the one hand, feeling so American, and then

一方面，感覺自己是如此的美國人，然後

on the other hand, being reminded by

另一方面，被提醒的是

peers that you are not neatly in that box.

同伴們，你們不是整齊地在那個盒子裡。

Would you all say that you had a similar experience to Qui

你們是否都會說，你們有類似於魁北克的經歷？

in that regard, or was that different based on where you

在這方面，還是根據你所在的地方而有所不同？

lived? 'Cause I know Miami is a very different

住？因為我知道邁阿密是一個非常不同的

experience than Arkansas.

經驗比阿肯色州多。

When you go to Miami, if you don't speak Spanish,

當你去邁阿密的時候，如果你不說西班牙語。

you feel out of place.

你覺得不合適。

Right.

對。

REBECCA PEREZ: So it wasn't until I moved out and actually

REBECCA PEREZ：所以直到我搬出去，並實際

moved, after college, to San Francisco that I experienced

大學畢業後，我搬到了舊金山，我經歷了

something outside of my culture and realized just how

在我的文化之外的東西，並意識到

different I was in comparison.

相比之下，我是不同的。

And there is a bit of, like, figuring out how

而且有一點，比如，弄清楚如何

to assimilate to a situation.

適應一種情況。

I almost feel like, as immigrants, you almost feel

我幾乎覺得，作為移民，你幾乎覺得

like, depending on the situation you're in, you lean

就像，根據你所處的情況，你會偏向於

into whatever works, right?

變成任何有用的東西，對嗎？

And when you're at home, you're whatever works there.

而當你在家的時候，你就是那裡的任何工作。

But it's all you.

但這都是你。

That's the irony.

這就是諷刺。

It's really hard to find your identity

要找到自己的身份真的很困難

when you're kind of faced with that situation.

當你面對這種情況的時候。

For me, living in Egypt and the U.S. and Australia,

對我來說，生活在埃及、美國和澳洲。

they all have very different cultures

他們都有非常不同的文化

and very different ideas.

和非常不同的想法。

Trying to fit in was always a challenge because I always felt

試圖融入社會始終是一個挑戰，因為我總是覺得

like I had to change myself.

就像我必須改變自己一樣。

When we first immigrated from Egypt to Australia,

當我們第一次從埃及移民到澳洲的時候。

the big cultural divide there was so drastic.

那裡的巨大文化鴻溝是如此之大。

And we moved into this small,

我們搬進了這個小。

majority-white small town, maybe about 100,000 people.

白人佔多數的小鎮，可能有10萬人左右。

So we were only maybe one of two families that were immigrants.

所以我們也許只是兩個移民家庭中的一個。

I was made fun of at school, and I purposely

我在學校被人取笑，我故意

stopped speaking Arabic.

不再講阿拉伯語。

It was all because I was trying so hard to fit in.

這都是因為我如此努力地想融入其中。

To me, it's a little bit of an unfortunate thing, because if I

對我來說，這是一個有點不幸的事情，因為如果我

were to go back to that, I would more

如果要回到這一點，我更願意

embrace that heritage, because to me,

擁抱這種遺產，因為對我來說。

that's far more enriching.

那就更充實了。

And it's so interesting to see the difference

看到這些差異是如此有趣

between that coming of age and, like,

在這一年齡段的到來和，如。

that fitting in happening when you're more

當你更多的時候，你就會發現，你的身體正在發生變化。

fully formed in your personality versus when you're a child

在你的個性中完全形成，與你是一個孩子的時候相比

and you feel some of those pressures a bit deeper.

而且你對其中一些壓力的感受更深一些。

So now how did you navigate that balancing act?

那麼，現在你是如何駕馭這種平衡行為的？

Trying to fit in while also trying to be authentically

試圖融入其中，同時也試圖做一個真實的人

who you are in multiple homes?

你是誰在多個家庭？

So I found comfort in finding people in the community who

是以，我找到了安慰，在社區中找到那些

shared the similar ideas, who embraced my background

有著類似想法的人，他們接受我的背景

and what I have to offer, and then just kind of, like,

和我所提供的東西，然後只是一種，像。

situating myself within those groups.

將自己置於這些群體中。

Introducing those groups also to my family

將這些團體也介紹給我的家人

so that my family knows, like, what I'm surrounding

以便我的家人知道，比如，我周圍有什麼東西

myself with, and then just kind of keeping

我自己，然後只是一種保持

that circle pretty tight.

這個圈子很緊。

Yeah, and what about you two?

是啊，那你們兩個呢？

I think I also-- in hindsight now,

我想我也......現在回想起來。

I realize that the friends I befriended were similar to me

我意識到，我結交的朋友與我相似

but very different, right?

但非常不同，對嗎？

There were also kids who had multiple cultures,

也有一些孩子擁有多種文化。

and in every aspect, right? 'Cause even Caucasian friends

和各方面，對嗎？因為即使是高加索人的朋友

who come from maybe a place that they don't fully fit in-- maybe

他們可能來自一個他們不完全適合的地方--也許是

there's someone who identifies in the LGBTQ community--

有一個認同LGBTQ社區的人 --

already, they're dealing with multiple versions of themselves

已經，他們正在處理多個版本的自己

in different spaces.

在不同的空間。

Yeah.

是的。

I mean, I don't know how much I tried to be anything.

我的意思是，我不知道我有多想成為什麼。

You know, you kind of just accidentally do that, right?

你知道，你只是不小心做了那件事，對嗎？

Like, you are what your friends are, right?

比如，你的朋友是什麼，你就是什麼，對嗎？

Like, I grew up primarily in a middle-class,

比如，我主要是在一箇中產階級中長大的。

like, Black neighborhood.

像，黑人社區。

So that was definitely part of who I was.

所以這絕對是我的一部分。

It wasn't till I left that neighborhood

直到我離開那個社區時，才發現

that I realized that I wasn't exactly like my friends,

我意識到我並不完全像我的朋友。

you know?

你知道嗎？

At a certain point, your world is

在某一點上，你的世界是

first your house, then your neighborhood, then the city.

首先是你的房子，然後是你的鄰居，然後是這個城市。

And then it gets bigger and bigger, right?

然後它變得越來越大，對嗎？

Right.

對。

But one of the things that helped affect my self-esteem

但是，有助於影響我的自尊心的一件事是

was a grand lie that my parents told me, and my grandma told me.

是我父母告訴我的一個大謊言，我的祖母也告訴我。

And that was that my small town, in isolation,

這就是我的小城鎮，與世隔絕。

was the only town that wasn't Vietnamese in all of America.

是全美國唯一一個不是越南人的城鎮。

Even when I knew it was a lie, I held onto it

即使我知道那是一個謊言，我還是堅持著。

'cause it was the one little thing that was like,

因為那是一件小事，就像。

you know what?

你知道嗎？

It might not be actually true, but maybe I can make it true.

這可能不是真正的事實，但也許我可以讓它成為事實。

Right, yeah.

對，是的。

And so it was stuff like that that

是以，就是這樣的東西，

kind of helped build me up.

這種幫助我建立起來的。

I felt empowered by my identity in kind

我覺得我的身份是善良的，我感到有力量。

of the most indirect way.

的最間接方式。

When I was really small, I couldn't

當我真的很小的時候，我不能

speak English basically at all.

基本上都會說英語。

And my teachers told my parents that they needed

而我的老師告訴我的父母，他們需要

to stop speaking Vietnamese to me so I could

阻止對我說越南語，以便我可以

have a chance to speak English.

有機會說英語。

But this meant my grandmother, who only spoke Vietnamese,

但這意味著我的祖母，她只會說越南語。

couldn't speak to me anymore.

不能再和我說話了。

And I remember the conversation she

而我記得她的談話

told me when I was around four.

在我四歲左右的時候告訴我。

"Right now, I have to stop talking to you.

"現在，我必須停止和你說話。

What I need you to do is learn how to talk like them.

我需要你做的是學習如何像他們那樣說話。

I know the superpower you're going to have one day is going

我知道你有一天會擁有的超能力是要

to be speaking like them and telling our stories using

要像他們那樣說話，並利用我們的故事講述我們的故事。

their language."

他們的語言"。

It was the thing that made me have a mission.

是它讓我有了一個使命。

It's my mission to tell their stories,

講述他們的故事是我的使命。

but it's also my mission to tell the stories

但我的任務也是講述這些故事

of anyone who often only gets to see themselves

往往只能看到自己的人的

in one kind of light.

在一種光中。

How do you think being an American

你如何看待作為一個美國人

with multiple cultural identities

具有多種文化身份的人

has shaped your creative voice?

塑造了你的創造性聲音？

Especially in animation, it tends to be

特別是在動畫中，它往往是

a very male-dominated industry.

一個非常以男性為主的行業。

And I think, personally, what I feel

而我個人認為，我的感受是

I bring that's authentic to myself--

我把那是真實的自己---

and I wish that more women would join the field--

我希望有更多的女性加入這個領域 --

is the woman's perspective.

是女人的視角。

Right.

對。

When you do have people behind the camera

當你確實有人在攝影機後面

telling the stories that are authentic to them,

講述對他們來說是真實的故事。

it shines through