Many pay people smugglers to escape to Malaysia.

很多人付錢給偷渡者，讓他們逃到馬來西亞。

Some make it many don't.

有的人成功了，有的人沒成功。

Some even end up in Indonesia after floating for months out in the open sea because no country will allow them entry.

有些人甚至在公海上漂流了幾個月後，因為沒有國家允許他們入境，最終被送到印度尼西亞。

At least a million Rohingya live as refugees in Bangladesh.

至少有100萬羅辛亞人作為難民生活在孟加拉國。

Most escaped a brutal military crackdown in their home Myanmar in 2017, and now their latest attempts at finding a place to call home have also been met with tragedy.

大多數人在2017年逃離了家鄉緬甸殘酷的軍事鎮壓，現在他們最近試圖尋找一個回家的地方，也遭遇了悲劇。

They've been promised and escape to a better life.

他們得到了承諾，逃到了更好的生活。

What they got was anything but These images were filmed by one of the traffickers he later abandoned.

他們得到的是任何東西，但這些畫面是由他後來拋棄的一個人販子拍攝的。

The ship, a 19 year old survivor pocketed the phone are searing record off the abuse.

艦，一名19歲的倖存者將手機裝進口袋，都是灼灼其華的記錄關虐 。

He too, suffered.

他也是苦不堪言。

Thank you.

謝謝你了

The rockin sailors came on the lower deck with sticks and fan belts and started beating us indiscriminately.

搖滾水手們拿著棍子和扇子帶來到下層甲板上，開始不分青紅皁白地打我們。

Women went silent instantly, but the man kept resisting.

女人瞬間安靜了下來，但男人卻一直在反抗。

They beat us mercilessly, bruising hands ripping off years breaking hands, the wreaked havoc on us And then, like many, Hassan wanted to escape the camp from Malaysia, where smugglers promised a bright future.

他們無情地毆打我們， 瘀傷的手撕開多年的手， 肆意破壞我們 然後，像許多人一樣，哈桑想逃離營地 從馬來西亞，走私者承諾一個光明的未來。

Now he is back in his squalid home in a Bangladesh refugee camp stuck with around a million others like him.

現在，他又回到了孟加拉國難民營中骯髒的家中，和其他大約一百萬個像他一樣的人困在一起。

Most of them had escaped a military crackdown in Myanmar in 2017, which U N.

他們中的大多數人在2017年逃離了緬甸的軍事鎮壓，聯合國。

Investigators said amounted to genocide.

調查人員說，這相當於種族滅絕。

They avoided death.

他們避免了死亡。

But for many their new life is one of misery.

但對許多人來說，他們的新生活是痛苦的。

The three Rohingya camps are very overcrowded.

三個羅興亞人營地非常擁擠。

Three smugglers are hunting potential victims every day did.

三名走私分子每天都在追捕潛在的受害者，沒有。

It's a multimillion dollar trade and involves people from various sectors, including fishermen who want a slice of the proceeds and even Rohingya refugees themselves.

這是一個價值數百萬美元的交易，涉及到各行各業的人，包括想要分一杯羹的漁民，甚至是羅興亞難民自己。

Some want to help families reunite Thesis the husband of Julie Harm Begum.

有的人想幫助家庭團聚論文朱莉-哈姆-貝格姆的丈夫。

She was told she would take less than a week to meet him in Malaysia.

有人告訴她，她要不到一個星期就能在馬來西亞見到他。

Her failed journey turned into a nightmare.

她失敗的旅程變成了一場噩夢。

One day, my sick sister got into an argument with a smuggler when she was coming back from the toilet and slapped him in the face thing.

有一天，我生病的妹妹上完廁所回來的時候和一個走私犯發生了爭執，然後打了他一巴掌的事情。

Smuggler beat my six sister with a leather belt.

走私者用皮筋打我六妹。

She bled to death.

她流血而死。

Still, stories like these aren't enough to scare off the desperate.

不過，這樣的故事還是不足以嚇退絕望的人。

Nearly 500 Rohingya Muslims crossed over to Malaysia this year, about 400 others landed in neighboring Indonesia.

今年有近500名羅興亞穆斯林越境到馬來西亞，還有約400人在鄰國印尼登陸。

But many more failed, returning home with horror stories to tell or died at sea before they could.

但更多的人失敗了，帶著恐怖的故事回國，或者還沒來得及回國就死在了海上。

And Phil Robertson is a deputy Asia director of Human Rights Watch.

而菲爾-羅伯遜是人權觀察組織的亞洲副主任。

He joins me now from Bangkok.

他現在在曼谷和我一起。

Phil is enough being done to prevent the smuggling often already persecuted people.

菲爾是足夠的被做，以防止走私往往已經迫害的人。

Well, quite clearly not.

嗯，很明顯不是。

In fact, these air syndicates that have been operating for a very long time with the primary aim to send Rohingya to Malaysia.

事實上，這些航空辛迪加的運作時間非常長，主要目的是把羅興亞人送到馬來西亞。

Uh, they have been changing their tactics as needed, depending on the sort of enforcement they see in places like Thailand or Malaysia.

呃，他們一直在根據需要改變策略，取決於他們在泰國或馬來西亞等地看到的執法情況。

But the bottom line is that Rohingya are subjected to horrible conditions, open boats with limited food and water, exposed the elements highly unsanitary and facing beatings and sexual harassment from the men who are supposed to deliver them to a new country.

但最重要的是，羅興亞人受到可怕的條件，開放的船隻，有限的食物和水，暴露的元素非常不衛生，並面臨著毆打和性騷擾的男人，誰應該把他們送到一個新的國家。

This kind of smuggling is not new, Phil.

這種走私並不新鮮，菲爾。

Why isn't any action being taken?

為什麼不採取任何行動？

Well, I think you have almost a game of whack a mole where you have various different crackdowns in some places and the traffickers pop up in another place.

我覺得你們幾乎是在玩 "打鼴鼠 "的遊戲，在一些地方有各種不同的打擊行動，而在另一個地方卻出現了人販子。

The reality is that there's a great deal of desperation in the camps.

現實情況是，營地裡有很多絕望的人。

There are almost no opportunities for people there, Uh, and they see the possibility of getting to Malaysia as being the promised land on many families.

那裡的人幾乎沒有機會，呃，他們認為有可能到馬來西亞是很多家庭的應許之地。

They're willing to mortgage whatever money and resource they have in the camps to try to get one person to Malaysia who they expect will then be the person who will send back Remittances and support the family, uh, into the future.

他們願意抵押他們在難民營裡的任何金錢和資源，試圖讓一個人去馬來西亞，他們希望這個人能夠寄回匯款，並支持這個家庭，呃，到未來。

But Malaysia hardly appears to be the promised land when it comes to the actual practice off.

但在實際的實踐關上，馬來西亞似乎很難成為承諾之地。

How the government is not accepting many of these people who arrived by boat.

政府是如何不接受這些乘船到達的許多人。

In fact, some of them are detained and others spend months out at sea, some of them even ending up in Indonesia.

事實上，他們中的一些人被拘留，另一些人則在海上度過了幾個月的時間，其中一些人甚至最終在印度尼西亞結束。

What does that say about the responsibility of nations like Malaysia and Indonesia?

這對馬來西亞和印度尼西亞等國的責任有何影響？

Well, Malaysia should be accepting these people.

嗯，馬來西亞應該接受這些人。

They should be bringing them ashore.

他們應該帶他們上岸。

They should be treating them as refugees and allowing them to undergo refugee status determination by the U.

他們應該把他們當作難民對待，讓他們接受美國的難民身份認定。

N.

N.

Refugee agency.

難民機構；

And actually, before the last year or so, that was what Malaysia generally was doing.

而實際上，在過去一年多以前，馬來西亞普遍都是這麼做的。

The situation changed during the Cove in 19 Pandemic and also with a new government in Malaysia that has, frankly, you xenophobia a zey point of reference in terms of its cove in 19 response Uh, you know, the government of million gassing the Prime Minister, uh, basically did nothing.

在19年大流行期間，情況發生了變化，也與馬來西亞的新政府，坦率地說，你排外主義的一個zey點，在其19年的反應呃，你知道，百萬毒氣總理的政府，呃，基本上什麼都沒做。

Aziz Rohingya have been increasingly targeted Malaysia by various different hate speech campaigns.

阿齊茲羅興亞人越來越多地成為各種不同的仇恨言論運動的目標馬來西亞。

And it's very sad that Malaysia, which used to be one of the champions for the Rohingya, has really fallen back so far.

而馬來西亞曾經是羅興亞人的擁護者之一，但現在卻真的退步到如此地步，這讓人非常難過。

Let's just go back to Bangladesh, where most of these refugees begin there.

讓我們回到孟加拉國，這些難民大多從那裡開始。

See what journeys from Is Bangladesh being able to manage nearly a million refugees singlehandedly?

看看從孟加拉國單槍匹馬管理近百萬難民的歷程是怎樣的？

Bangladesh needs more support from the international community and it's not getting it.

孟加拉國需要國際社會更多的支持，但它沒有得到。

That's a big problem.

這是個大問題。

There is a certain degree of donor fatigue that needs to be recognized.

需要認識到，捐贈者有一定程度的疲勞。

Uh, everybody is appreciative of the fact that Bangladesh received these people that they open the border and allowed them to come across.

呃，大家都很感激孟加拉國接納這些人，允許他們開放邊境，讓他們過來。

But now Bangladesh is increasingly taking a very hostile position towards the Rohingya.

但現在孟加拉國對羅興亞人越來越採取非常敵對的立場。

In some cases, air trying thio involuntarily move people to what is a de facto prison island.

在某些情況下，空氣試圖thio非自願移動人們到什麼是事實上的監獄島。

Basan char.

Basan char。

You know, they're trying to get the attention of the international community to focus pressure on the government in Myanmar, and I think that's a laudable goal.

你知道，他們正試圖引起國際社會的關注，對緬甸政府施加壓力，我認為這是一個值得稱讚的目標。

But unfortunately they're using the Rohingya a zey method to try to, uh, get the international community to act.

但不幸的是，他們正在利用羅興亞人的方法來試圖，呃，讓國際社會採取行動。

And, you know, treating people badly to try to get more reaction from the international community is not the right way forward.

而且，你知道，為了試圖從國際社會獲得更多的反應，而對人不好，這不是正確的前進方向。

Speaking of passions, are these Flood prone island refugees have already begun to be moved there.

說到激情，這些易受洪水侵襲的島嶼難民是不是已經開始轉移到那裡了。

Uh, do we have any initial reports as to how they're doing?

呃，我們有任何初步報告 他們是如何做的？

Well, there's over 1600 of them there now.

嗯，現在那裡有超過1600個。

Many of them were duped into going and told that they might be at the head of a resettlement Q or would have lively hoods.

他們中的許多人被騙去，並被告知可能會在安置Q頭或會有熱鬧的罩子。

Uh, there are a lot of people were quite unhappy.

呃，有很多人都挺不開心的。

Uh, you know, there's a real lack of livelihood there.

呃，你知道，那裡確實缺乏生計。

Um, you know, Bangladesh has said that they're going to allow them to fish and farm on that island, but the actual groundwater is too salty for for planting, and, uh, the the fishing.

孟加拉說他們會允許他們在島上捕魚和養殖 但實際的地下水含鹽量太高，不適合種植，還有，捕魚。

They're not allowing these people to have their own boats because they would leave.

他們不允許這些人擁有自己的船，因為他們會離開。

So it's ah, it's essentially become a de facto prison island, and that's a that's a major problem.

所以，它是啊，它基本上成為 一個事實上的監獄島， 而這是一個 這是一個主要的問題。

People are unhappy and people have protested and they faced Reprisals for that.

人們不高興，人們進行了抗議，並是以面臨報復。

Phil Robertson.

Phil Robertson

Thank you very much for joining us on this.

非常感謝你加入我們的行列。

For some, though, the journey across the Bay of Bengal and the Andaman Sea can end in tragedy.

但對一些人來說，橫跨孟加拉灣和安達曼海的旅程可能以悲劇收場。

But many are able to survive like the family off knee Marcia.

但很多人都能像脫膝瑪西亞一家一樣生存下來。

It was earlier this year that name Marcia held a funeral ceremony for his wife and daughter.

今年年初，名瑪西亞才為妻子和女兒舉行了葬禮儀式。

They left Bangladesh and a rickety boat to join him in Malaysia, where he was working.

他們離開了孟加拉國和一艘搖搖欲墜的船，到他工作的馬來西亞去投奔他。

But then he heard nothing from them.

但後來他沒有聽到他們的任何消息。

When I worked in Malaysia, I used to save part of my salary.

我在馬來西亞工作的時候，經常把工資的一部分存起來。

I sent money to my family every month.

我每個月都給家裡寄錢。

My wife saved the money to pay for the boat.

我老婆省吃儉用，把錢買了船。

She arranged the trip by herself and she did it without discussing it with me.

她自己安排的行程，她沒有和我商量就做了。

He'd given them up for dead.

他已經把他們送上了絕路。

But then a miracle e saw on the news on videos on the Internet that about 100 Ringo landed here on a boat.

但後來，一個奇蹟發生了，我在網上的視頻新聞上看到，大約有100名林檎在這裡乘船登陸。

Someone pointed out my wife and daughter to me in the images.

有人在圖片中向我指出了我的妻子和女兒。

There, there, we gotta do it.

在那裡，在那裡，我們必須做到這一點。

I looked at that time.

我看了看當時的情況。

No mas wife, Madu MMA is here in the bottom, left holding her six year old daughter, E.

沒有馬斯老婆，馬杜MA在下面，左邊抱著6歲的女兒E。

When I saw them, I called my mother and my wife's mother told them they were alive.

看到他們，我就給我媽打電話，我老婆的媽媽告訴他們還活著。

That was the happiest day of my life.

那是我一生中最快樂的一天。

The boat, carrying almost 100 Rohingya refugees from camps in Bangladesh, was told to Indonesia's Sumatra island by locals.

這艘船載有近100名來自孟加拉國難民營的羅興亞難民，被當地人告知前往印尼蘇門答臘島。

The refugees said they spent four horrific months at sea, surviving on rice nuts on rainwater.

難民們說，他們在海上度過了4個月可怕的日子，靠雨水中的米果生存。

On that, at least one person died.

上，至少有一人死亡。

Oh, from Malaysia, Shall was able to speak with his wife by phone.

哦，來自馬來西亞的Shall可以和妻子通電話。

He quit his construction job and made his way illegally by boat to Indonesia.

他辭去了建築業的工作，乘船非法來到印尼。

There he's stuck into the refugee camp and found his family.

在那裡，他被困在難民營裡，找到了自己的家人。

Di Autumn E was only hoping to be happy and thinking about when I could live together with my husband again.

狄秋娥只盼著幸福，想著什麼時候能再和丈夫一起生活。

Thank God he came here.

謝天謝地，他來到了這裡。

I'm happy we're here together now.

我很高興我們現在在一起。

But despite that stroke of fortune, conditions in the camp are tough.

不過，儘管有這個運氣，但營地的條件卻很艱苦。

They only have this small space to call their own.

他們只有這一小塊空間可以稱得上是自己的。

Sometimes they buy nuts or small extras from local market sellers to supplement the food they're given.

有時，他們會從當地市場的賣家那裡購買堅果或小的額外食物來補充他們的食物。

I'm very happy to meet my husband here, but I feel sorry for my daughter when she wants to eat something and we can't give her anything because my husband has no income.

我很高興在這裡遇到老公，但是女兒想吃點東西，我們又不能給她，因為老公沒有收入，我覺得很對不起她。

The lives of Nima Madu, MMA and their daughter are governed by the rhythms of the camp, but also by economic forces and immigration laws over which they have no control.

尼瑪-馬杜、MMA和他們女兒的生活受制於營地的節奏，也受制於他們無法控制的經濟力量和移民法。

My but now the living hand in hand one day at the time.

我的但現時活著的手拉手一天的時間。