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  • I want to tell you about my search for purpose as a journalist

    我想告訴你我作為一個記者尋找目標的過程

  • and how Dolly Parton helped me figure it out.

    以及多莉帕頓是如何幫我解決的。

  • So I've been telling audio stories for about 20 years,

    所以我講音頻故事已經有20年了。

  • first on the radio and then in podcasts.

    先是在電臺,然後在播客中。

  • When I started the radio show "Radiolab" in 2002,

    當我開始廣播節目 "Radiolab "在2002年。

  • here was the quintessential story move we would do.

    這是典型的故事動作,我們會做。

  • We'd bring on somebody --

    我們會找人...

  • (Audio) Steven Strogatz: It's one of the most hypnotic

    史蒂文-斯特羅加茨:這是最有催眠效果的一種。

  • and spellbinding spectacles in nature,

    和自然界中令人神魂顛倒的景象。

  • because, you have to keep in mind, it is absolutely silent.

    因為,你要記住,它是絕對沉默的。

  • Jad Abumrad: Like this guy, mathematician, Steve Strogatz,

    賈德-阿布姆拉德:比如這個人,數學家,史蒂夫-斯特羅加茨。

  • and he would paint a picture.

    他就會畫一幅畫。

  • SS: Picture it. There's a riverbank in Thailand,

    SS:想象一下吧。泰國有一條河岸。

  • in the remote part of the jungle,

    在叢林的偏遠地區。

  • you're in a canoe, slipping down the river.

    你在一個獨木舟, 滑下河。

  • There's no sound of anything,

    沒有任何聲音。

  • maybe the occasional, you know, exotic jungle bird or something.

    也許偶爾,你知道,異國情調的叢林鳥什麼的。

  • JA: So you're in this imaginary canoe with Steve,

    JA:所以你在這個想象中的獨木舟與史蒂夫。

  • and in the air all around you are millions of fireflies.

    在你周圍的空氣中,有數百萬只螢火蟲。

  • And what you see is sort of a randomized starry-night effect.

    而你看到的是一種隨機的星夜效應。

  • Because all the fireflies are blinking at different rates.

    因為所有的螢火蟲都在以不同的速度閃爍。

  • Which is what you would expect.

    這是你所期望的。

  • But according to Steve, in this one place,

    但據史蒂夫說,在這一個地方。

  • for reasons no scientist can fully explain --

    出於沒有科學家能夠完全解釋的原因 --

  • SS: Whoop.

    SS:喔。

  • Whoop.

    哇哦

  • Whoop.

    哇哦

  • With thousands of lights on and then off, all in sync.

    有了上千盞燈的開啟,然後再關閉,所有的燈都是同步的。

  • (Music and electric sounds)

    (音樂和電聲)

  • JA: Now it's around this time

    JA:現在是這個時候

  • that I would generally bring in the beautiful music, as I just did,

    我一般都會像剛才那樣,把優美的音樂帶進來。

  • and you'd start to get that warm feeling.

    你會開始得到那種溫暖的感覺。

  • A feeling, that we know from science,

    一種感覺,我們從科學中知道。

  • kind of localizes in your head and chest

    在你的頭部和胸部的一種局部

  • and spreads through your body.

    並在你的身體裡蔓延。

  • It's that feeling of wonder.

    就是那種奇妙的感覺。

  • From 2002 to 2010, I did hundreds of these stories.

    從2002年到2010年,我做了幾百個這樣的故事。

  • Sciency, neurosciency, very heady, brainy stories

    科學性、神經科學性、很牛逼、腦洞大開的故事。

  • that would always resolve into that feeling of wonder.

    總會化解成那種奇妙的感覺。

  • And I began to see that as my job,

    我開始把這看作是我的工作。

  • to lead people to moments of wonder.

    來引領人們進入奇蹟的時刻。

  • What that sounded like was:

    這話聽起來像是。

  • (Various voices) "Huh!" "Wow!" "Wow!"

    (各種聲音)"咦!""哇!""哇!"

  • "That's amazing."

    "真是太神奇了。"

  • "Whoa!" "Wow!"

    "哇!""哇!"

  • JA: But I began to get kind of tired of these stories.

    JA:但我開始對這些故事有點厭倦了。

  • I mean, partially, it was the repetition.

    我的意思是,部分原因是重複。

  • I remember there was a day I was sitting at the computer,

    記得有一天,我坐在電腦前。

  • making the sound of a neuron.

    發出神經元的聲音。

  • (Crackling sound)

    (噼裡啪啦的聲音)

  • You know, take some white noise, chop it up, very easy sound to make.

    你知道,拿一些白噪音,把它切碎,很容易發出聲音。

  • I remember thinking, "I have made this sound 25 times."

    我記得我在想,"我已經發出這個聲音25次了。"

  • But it was more than that --

    但這還不止於此 --

  • there was a familiar path to these stories.

    這些故事有一個熟悉的路徑。

  • You walk the path of truth, which is made of science,

    你走在真理的道路上,這是由科學構成的。

  • and you get to wonder.

    你就會想知道。

  • Now, I love science, don't get me wrong.

    現在,我喜歡科學,不要誤會我的意思。

  • My parents emigrated from a war-torn country,

    我的父母是從一個戰亂的國家移民過來的。

  • came to America,

    來到美國。

  • and science for them was, like, more their identity than anything else,

    和科學對他們來說是一樣, 更多的是他們的身份比什麼都重要。

  • and I inherited that from them.

    我從他們那裡繼承了這一點。

  • But there was something about that simple movement

    但是,那個簡單的動作有什麼意義呢?

  • from science to wonder

    從科學到奇蹟

  • that just started to feel wrong to me.

    這只是開始 感覺不對我。

  • Like, is that the only path a story can take?

    就像,故事只有這一條路可以走嗎?

  • Around 2012,

    2012年前後。

  • I ran into a bunch of different stories that made me think, "No."

    我遇到了一堆不同的故事,讓我覺得,"不"。

  • One story in particular,

    特別是一個故事。

  • where we interviewed a guy who described chemical weapons

    我們採訪了一個描述化學武器的人

  • being used against him and his fellow villagers

    被用來對付他和他的同村人

  • in the mountains of Laos.

    在寮國的山區。

  • Western scientists went there,

    西方科學家去了那裡。

  • measured for chemical weapons, didn't find any.

    測量了化學武器,沒有發現任何化學武器。

  • We interviewed the man about this,

    我們就此採訪了他。

  • he said the scientists were wrong.

    他說,科學家們都錯了。

  • We said, "But they tested."

    我們說,"但他們測試。"

  • He said, "I don't care, I know what happened to me."

    他說:"我不在乎,我知道我的遭遇。"

  • And we went back and forth and back and forth,

    我們來來回回,來來回回。

  • and make a long story short,

    並長話短說。

  • the interview ended in tears.

    採訪以淚水結束。

  • I felt ...

    我覺得...

  • I felt horrible.

    我覺得很可怕。

  • Like, hammering at a scientific truth, when someone has suffered.

    就像,錘鍊一個科學的真理,當有人遭受。

  • That wasn't going to heal anything.

    那是不會治癒任何東西的。

  • And maybe I was relying too much on science to find the truth.

    而也許我是太依賴科學來尋找真相了。

  • And it really did feel, at that moment,

    而那一刻,真的覺得,。

  • that there were a lot of truths in the room,

    那房間裡有很多真相。

  • and we were only looking at one of them.

    而我們只看了其中的一個。

  • So I thought, "I've got to get better at this."

    所以我想,"我一定要把這個做得更好。"

  • And so for the next eight years,

    於是在接下來的八年裡。

  • I committed myself to doing stories where you heard truths collide.

    我致力於做你聽到的真理碰撞的故事。

  • We did stories about the politics of consent,

    我們做了關於同意政治的故事。

  • where you heard the perspective of survivors and perpetrators

    在那裡你聽到了倖存者和施害者的觀點;

  • whose narratives clashed.

    其敘事發生衝突。

  • We did stories about race,

    我們做了關於種族的故事。

  • how black men are systematically eliminated from juries,

    黑人是如何被系統地從陪審團中淘汰的。

  • and yet, the rules that try and prevent that from happening

    然而,試圖阻止這種情況發生的規則。

  • only make things worse.

    只會讓事情變得更糟。

  • Stories about counter terrorism, Guantanamo detainees,

    關於反恐、關塔那摩被拘留者的故事。

  • stories where everything is disputed,

    的故事,一切都有爭議。

  • all you can do is struggle to try and make sense.

    你所能做的就是掙扎著去嘗試和理解。

  • And this struggle kind of became the point.

    而這種鬥爭也算是成為了重點。

  • I began to think, "Maybe that's my job."

    我開始想,"也許這就是我的工作。"

  • To lead people to moments of struggle.

    引導人們走向奮鬥的時刻。

  • Here's what that sounded like:

    這是什麼,聽起來像。

  • (Various voices) "But I see -- I, like --"

    (各種聲音) "但我看到 - 我,喜歡 -"

  • "Uh, I --" (Sighs)

    "呃,我--"(嘆氣)

  • "Well, so, like, huh --"

    "嗯,所以,就像,呵呵--"

  • "That, I mean, I --"

    "那個,我是說,我--"

  • "You know -- golly -- I --" (Sighs)

    "你知道--天哪--我--"(嘆氣)

  • JA: And that sigh right there,

    JA:還有那一聲嘆息就在那裡。

  • I wanted to hear that sound in every single story,

    我想在每一個故事中都聽到這種聲音。

  • because that sound is kind of our current moment, right?

    因為這種聲音是一種我們現在的時刻,對不對?

  • We live in a world where truth is no longer just a set of facts

    我們生活在一個真理不再只是一組事實的世界裡。

  • to be captured.

    要抓。

  • It's become a process.

    這已經成為一個過程。

  • It's gone from being a noun to being a verb.

    它從一個名詞變成了一個動詞。

  • But how do you end that story?

    但你怎麼結束這個故事?

  • Like, what literally kept happening is we'd be, you know, telling a story,

    就像,從字面上看,我們一直在發生的是,你知道,講一個故事。

  • cruising along, two viewpoints in conflict,

    巡視,兩種觀點的衝突。

  • you get to the end and it's just like --

    你得到的最後,它只是喜歡 -

  • No, let me see.

    不,讓我看看。

  • What do I say at the end?

    最後我怎麼說?

  • Oh, my God.

    哦,我的上帝。

  • What do you -- how do you end that story?

    你... 你怎麼結束這個故事?

  • You can't just happily-ever-after it,

    你不能就這樣幸福地過下去。

  • because that doesn't feel real.

    因為那感覺不真實

  • At the same time,

    同時。

  • if you just leave people in that stuck place,

    如果你只是讓人們在那個困頓的地方。

  • like, "Why did I just listen to that?"

    像,"為什麼我只是聽了嗎?"

  • Like, it felt like there had to be another move there.

    就像,感覺那裡必須有另一個動作。

  • Had to be a way beyond the struggle.

    不得不說是一種超越奮鬥的方式。

  • And this is what brings me to Dolly.

    這就是我為什麼會想到多莉。

  • Or Saint Dolly, as we like to call her in the South.

    或者聖多莉,我們在南方喜歡叫她。

  • I want to tell you about one little glimmer of an epiphany that I had,

    我想告訴你,我的一個小小的頓悟。

  • doing a nine-part series called "Dolly Parton's America" last year.

    去年做了一個名為 "多莉-帕頓的美國 "的九部分系列。

  • It was a bit of a departure for me,

    這對我來說,有點離經叛道。

  • but I just had this intuition that Dolly could help me

    但我只是有這樣的直覺,多莉可以幫助我。

  • figure out this ending problem.

    弄清楚這個結局問題。

  • And here was the basic intuition:

    而這裡是基本的直覺。

  • You go to a Dolly concert,

    你去看多莉的演唱會

  • you see men in trucker hats standing next to men in drag,

    你會看到戴著卡車司機帽子的男人站在穿拖鞋的男人旁邊。

  • Democrats standing next to Republicans,

    民主黨人站在共和黨人旁邊。

  • women holding hands,

    牽手的女人。

  • every different kind of person smashed together.

    每一個不同類型的人砸在一起。

  • All of these people that we are told should hate each other

    所有這些人,我們被告知應該互相仇恨

  • are there singing together.

    都在那裡一起唱歌。

  • She somehow carved out this unique space in America,

    她以某種方式在美國開闢了這個獨特的空間。

  • and I wanted to know, how did she do that?

    我想知道,她是怎麼做到的?

  • So I interviewed Dolly 12 times, two separate continents.

    所以我採訪了12次多莉,兩個不同的大陸。

  • She started every interview this way:

    她每次面試都是這樣開始的。

  • (Audio) Dolly Parton: Ask me whatever you ask me,

    (音頻) Dolly Parton:問我什麼你問我。

  • and I'm going to tell you what I want you to hear.

    我要告訴你我想讓你聽到的東西。

  • (Laughter)

    (笑聲)

  • JA: She is undeniably a force of nature.

    JA:她無疑是一種自然的力量。

  • But the problem that I ran into

    但我遇到的問題是

  • is that I had chosen a conceit for this series

    是我為這個系列選擇了一個設想。

  • that my soul had trouble with.

    我的靈魂有問題。

  • Dolly sings a lot about the South.

    多莉唱了很多關於南方的歌。

  • If you go through her discography,

    如果你翻閱她的唱片記錄。

  • you will hear song after song about Tennessee.

    你會聽到一首又一首關於田納西的歌。

  • (Music) DP: (Singing, various songs) Tennessee, Tennessee...

    (音樂)DP:(唱,各種歌曲)田納西,田納西......。

  • Tennessee homesick ...

    田納西州想家了...

  • I've got those Tennessee homesick blues runnin' through my head.

    我腦海裡有田納西州的思鄉藍調。

  • Tennessee.

    田納西州。

  • JA: "Tennessee Mountain Home," "Tennessee Mountain Memories."

    JA:"田納西山家園","田納西山記憶"。

  • Now I grew up in Tennessee,

    現在我在田納西州長大。

  • and I felt no nostalgia for that place.

    而我對那個地方沒有任何懷念的感覺。

  • I was the scrawny Arab kid

    我就是那個瘦弱的阿拉伯孩子

  • who came from the place that invented suicide bombing.

    誰來自發明自殺式爆炸的地方。

  • I spent a lot of time in my room.

    我花了很多時間在我的房間裡。

  • When I left Nashville,

    當我離開納什維爾時,

  • I left.

    我離開了

  • I remember being at Dollywood,

    我還記得在多莉木的時候。

  • standing in front of a replica, replica of her Tennessee Mountain Home.

    站在她的田納西山莊的複製品前,複製品。

  • People all around me were crying.

    我周圍的人都在哭。

  • This is a set.

    這是一套。

  • Why are you crying?

    你為什麼哭?

  • I couldn't understand why they were so emotional,

    我不明白他們為什麼這麼情緒化。

  • especially given my relationship to the South.

    特別是考慮到我和南方的關係。

  • And I started to honestly have panic attacks about this.

    而我開始老實說對這個有恐慌症。

  • "Am I not the right person for this project?"

    "我是不是不適合做這個項目?"

  • But then ...

    但後來...

  • twist of fate.

    命運的轉折。

  • We meet this guy, Bryan Seaver,

    我們來見見這個人,布萊恩-西弗。

  • Dolly's nephew and bodyguard.

    多莉的侄子和保鏢。

  • And on a whim, he drives producer Shima Oliaee and I

    他一時興起,就開車帶著我和製作人希瑪-奧麗婭依

  • out of Dollywood,

    從多利塢出來的。

  • round the back side of the mountains,

    繞過後山的一面。

  • up the mountains 20 minutes,

    上山20分鐘。

  • down a narrow dirt road,

    在一條狹窄的土路上。

  • through giant wooden gates that look right out of "Game of Thrones,"

    穿過巨大的木門,看起來就像 "權力的遊戲"。

  • and into the actual Tennessee Mountain Home.

    並進入實際的天山家園。

  • But the real place.

    但真正的地方。

  • Valhalla.

    瓦爾哈拉

  • The real Tennessee Mountain Home.

    真正的田納西山居。

  • And I'm going to score this part with Wagner,

    而我要用瓦格納給這部分配樂。

  • because you've got to understand,

    因為你得明白。

  • in Tennessee lore,

    在田納西州的傳說中。

  • this is like hallowed ground, the Tennessee Mountain Home.

    這就像聖地,田納西山莊。

  • So I remember standing there, on the grass,

    所以我記得站在那裡,在草地上。

  • next to the Pigeon River,

    旁邊的鴿子河。

  • butterflies doing loopty loops in the air,

    蝴蝶在空中做環形圈。

  • and I had my own moment of wonder.

    而我也有自己的奇蹟時刻。

  • Dolly's Tennessee Mountain Home

    多莉的田納西山莊

  • looks exactly like my dad's home in the mountains of Lebanon.

    看起來就像我爸爸在黎巴嫩山區的家一樣。

  • Her house looks just like the place that he left.

    她的房子看起來就像他離開的地方。

  • And that simple bit of layering led me to have a conversation with him

    就因為這簡單的一點鋪墊,讓我和他有了對話的機會

  • that I'd never had before,

    我從來沒有過的。

  • about the pain he felt leaving his home.

    關於他離家的痛苦。

  • And how he hears that in Dolly's music.

    他是如何從多莉的音樂中聽到的。

  • Then I had a conversation with Dolly where she described her songs

    然後我和多莉有一次談話,她描述了她的歌曲。

  • as migration music.

    作為遷移音樂。

  • Even that classic song,

    即使是那首經典的歌曲。

  • "Tennessee Mountain Home," if you listen to it --

    "田納西山居",如果你聽了它 --

  • (Dolly Parton "Tennessee Mountain Home")

    (多莉-帕頓 "田納西山居")

  • "Sittin' on the front porch on a summer afternoon

    "夏日午後,坐在前廊上

  • In a straight-backed chair on two legs,

    在兩腿直背的椅子上。

  • leaned against the wall."

    靠在牆上。"

  • It's about trying to capture a moment that you know is already gone.

    這是關於試圖捕捉一個你知道已經過去的瞬間。

  • But if you can paint it, vividly,

    但如果你能把它畫出來,生動地畫出來。

  • maybe you can freeze it in place, almost like in resin,

    也許你可以把它凍在原地,就像在樹脂裡一樣。

  • trapped between past and present.

    困在過去和現在之間。

  • That is the immigrant experience.

    這就是移民的經歷。

  • And that simple thought led me to a million conversations.

    而這個簡單的想法,卻讓我有了無數次的對話。

  • I started talking to musicologists about country music as a whole.

    我開始和音樂學家討論鄉村音樂的整體情況。

  • This genre that I've always felt so

    這種類型,我一直覺得是這樣的

  • having nothing to do with where I came from

    籍籍無名

  • is actually made up of instruments and musical styles

    其實是由樂器和音樂風格組成的

  • that came directly from the Middle East.

    直接來自中東的。

  • In fact, there were trade routes that ran from what is now Lebanon

    事實上,從現在的黎巴嫩開始,就有了貿易路線

  • right up into the mountains of East Tennessee.

    直達東田納西州的山區。

  • I can honestly say, standing there, looking at her home,

    我可以坦白地說,站在那裡,看著她的家。

  • was the first time I felt like I'm a Tennessean.

    是我第一次覺得自己是個田納西人。

  • That is honestly true.

    說實話,這是真的。

  • And this wasn't a one-time thing,

    而且這不是一次性的事情。

  • I mean, over and over again,

    我的意思是,一遍又一遍。

  • she would force me beyond the simple categories

    她會迫使我超越簡單的範疇

  • I had constructed for the world.

    我為這個世界構建的。

  • I remember talking with her about her seven-year partnership

    我還記得和她聊過她七年的合作關係。

  • with Porter Wagoner.

    與波特-瓦格納。

  • 1967, she joins his band, he is the biggest thing in country music,

    1967年,她加入了他的樂隊,他是鄉村音樂界最大的事情。

  • she is a backup singer, a nobody.

    她是一個備份歌手,一個無名小卒。

  • Within a short time, she gets huge,

    在很短的時間內,她變得巨大。

  • he gets jealous,

    他吃醋了。

  • he then sues her for three million dollars

    然後,他起訴她300萬美元

  • when she tries to leave.

    當她想離開的時候

  • Now it would be really easy to see Porter Wagoner

    現在要看到波特-瓦格納真的很簡單

  • as, like, a type: classic, patriarchal jackass,

    作為,喜歡的類型:經典的,重男輕女的混蛋。

  • trying to hold her back.

    試圖阻止她。

  • But any time I would suggest that to her,

    但任何時候我都會向她建議。

  • like, come on.

    喜歡,來吧。

  • (Audio) This is a guy, I mean, you see it in the videos too,

    (音頻)這是一個人,我是說,你在視頻中也看到了。

  • he's got his arm around you.

    他抱著你的手臂。

  • There's a power thing happening, for sure.

    權力的事情肯定會發生。

  • DP: Well, it's more complicated than that.

    DP:嗯,它比這更復雜。

  • I mean, just think about it.

    我的意思是,想想看吧。

  • He had had this show for years,

    他有這個節目好多年了。

  • he didn't need me to have his hit show.

    他不需要我有他的熱門節目。

  • He wasn't expecting me to be all that I was, either.

    他也沒有想到我會成為我的全部。

  • I was a serious entertainer, he didn't know that.

    我是一個嚴肅的藝人,他不知道。

  • He didn't know how many dreams I had.

    他不知道我有多少夢想。

  • JA: In effect, she kept telling me,

    JA:實際上,她一直在告訴我。

  • "Don't bring your stupid way of seeing the world into my story,

    "不要把你看世界的愚蠢方式帶到我的故事裡。

  • because that's not what it was.

    因為這不是它是什麼。

  • Yeah, there was power, but that's not all there was.

    是的,有權力,但這不是全部。

  • You can't summarize this."

    你不能這樣總結。"

  • Alright, just to zoom out.

    好吧,只是為了放大。

  • What do I make of this?

    我怎麼看這個問題?

  • Well, I think there's something in here that's a clue, a way forward.

    我想這裡面有些東西是個線索,是前進的方向。

  • As journalists, we love difference.

    作為記者,我們喜歡與眾不同。

  • We love to fetishize difference.

    我們喜歡迷信差異。

  • But increasingly, in this confusing world,

    但是,在這個混亂的世界裡,越來越多。

  • we need to be the bridge between those differences.

    我們需要成為這些差異之間的橋樑。

  • But how do you do that?

    但你怎麼做呢?

  • I think for me, now, the answer is simple.

    我想對我來說,現在的答案很簡單。

  • You interrogate those differences,

    你審視這些差異。

  • you hold them for as long as you can,

    你儘可能地保持他們的時間,你可以。

  • until, like up on that mountain,

    直到,像在那座山上。

  • something happens,

    事情發生了。

  • something reveals itself.

    東西顯露出來。

  • Story cannot end in difference.

    故事不能在差異中結束。

  • It's got to end in revelation.

    它必須以啟示結束。

  • And coming back from that trip on the mountain,

    而從那次上山回來。

  • a friend of mine gave me a book that gave this whole idea a name.

    我的一個朋友給了我一本書,給了這個想法一個名字。

  • In psychotherapy, there's this idea called the third,

    在心理治療中,有這樣一個想法,叫第三種。

  • which essentially goes like this.

    基本上是這樣的。

  • Typically, we think of ourselves as these autonomous units.

    通常情況下,我們認為自己就是這些自主組織、部門。

  • I do something to you, you do something to me.

    我對你做什麼,你就對我做什麼。

  • But according to this theory, when two people come together

    但是根據這個理論,當兩個人走到一起的時候

  • and really commit to seeing each other,

    並真正承諾要見對方。

  • in that mutual act of recognition,

    在這種相互承認的行為中,

  • they actually make something new.

    他們居然做出了新的東西。

  • A new entity that is their relationship.

    一個新的實體,是他們的關係。

  • You can think of Dolly's concerts as sort of a cultural third space.

    你可以把多莉的音樂會看作是一種文化第三空間。

  • The way she sees all the different parts of her audience,

    她看到所有不同部分的觀眾的方式。

  • the way they see her,

    他們看她的方式。

  • creates the spiritual architecture of that space.

    創造了這個空間的精神架構。

  • And I think now that is my calling.

    我想現在這就是我的使命。

  • That as a journalist,

    那作為一個記者。

  • as a storyteller,

    作為一個講故事的人。

  • as just an American,

    作為只是一個美國人。

  • living in a country struggling to hold,

    生活在一個掙扎著保持的國家裡。

  • that every story I tell has got to find the third.

    我講的每一個故事都要找到第三個。

  • That place where the things we hold as different

    那個我們認為不同的東西的地方

  • resolve themselves into something new.

    化解成新的東西。

  • Thank you.

    謝謝你了

I want to tell you about my search for purpose as a journalist

我想告訴你我作為一個記者尋找目標的過程

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