伯尼-桑德斯訪談錄（全集 (Bernie Sanders | The Young Turks Interview (FULL))

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WELCOME TO THE YOUNG TURKS.
HAVE WE GOT AN INTERESTING SHOW FOR YOU TONIGHT.
NORMALLY WE WOULD GO STORY BY STORY, AND WE WILL.
ANA WILL JOIN ME FOR THAT.
BUT RIGHT NOW WE HAVE A VERY RARE LIVE INTERVIEW AND
THAT IS BECAUSE BERNIE SANDERS IS IN THE STUDIO.
SENATOR SANDERS, WELCOME.
IT'S A PLEASURE TO BE HERE.
THERE IS LOTS TO TALK ABOUT.
ALMOST A YEAR AGO YOU WERE DOWN ONLY 59 POINTS IN THE POLLS.
THAT WAS A GOOD POLL.
THIS WEEK YOU ARE WITHIN FIVE POINTS OF HILLARY CLINTON.
YOU'VE WON 12
CONTESTS SO FAR, BUT I HAVE INTERVIEWED YOU IN THE PAST
AND MY HONEST ASSESSMENT IS THAT YOU WOULD'VE HAD NO CHANCE,
12 YEARS AGO, EIGHT YEARS AGO, OR EVEN FOUR YEARS AGO.
DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT, AND IF YOU DO, WHAT DO YOU THINK
HAS CHANGED SO DRAMATICALLY TO PUT YOU IN THIS POSITION?
I DO AGREE WITH YOUR ASSESSMENT.
I THINK THAT IS WHAT IS HAPPENING IS PEOPLE ARE LOOKING
AT THE WORLD IN WHICH THEY ARE LIVING, WHAT THEY ARE SEEING IS
THEY ARE WORKING IN MANY CASES LONGER HOURS, FOR LOW WAGES.
THEY ARE SEEING THAT THEY CANNOT AFFORD TO SEND THEIR KIDS
TO COLLEGE, AND THEY WORRY ABOUT THE FUTURE OF THEIR CHILDREN.
I THINK THAT IS EMOTIONALLY ñ AND NO MATTER WHETHER YOU
ARE CONSERVATIVE OR PROGRESSIVE, YOU THINK THAT SUCKS.
THAT IS NOT WHAT AMERICAN DEMOCRACY IS.
AND I FIND A LOT OF PEOPLE COMING TOGETHER ON THAT.
THE OTHER ISSUE IS PEOPLE SEE A CORRUPT CAMPAIGN FINANCE SYSTEM.
WHERE BILLIONAIRES ARE BUYING ELECTIONS AND THEY ARE
UNHAPPY ABOUT THAT.
AND THEN YOU HAVE THE MOST SANE PEOPLE THAT UNDERSTAND THAT
CLIMATE CHANGE IS GOING TO CAUSE DEVASTATING PROBLEMS UNLESS
WE GET A HANDLE ON IT.
SO, WHY NOW DO YOU THINK THAT FRUSTRATION HAS BUILT TO A
CLIMAX AND WITH THE SENSE OF, WELL, NOTHING IS EVER GOING
TO CHANGE, ESPECIALLY WITH THE MONEY IN POLITICS ISSUE.
I THINK THE FOLKS WHO TOOK ON WALL STREET DESERVE SOME
CREDIT FOR RAISING THE ISSUE OF INCOME AND WEALTH INEQUALITY.
I THINK THE COMBINATION OF SIMPLY THE REALITY OF
AMERICAN LIFE ñ PEOPLE ASK THEMSELVES, WHY ARE WE THE
ONLY COUNTRY THAT DOESN'T CARE ABOUT THE HEALTH OF THE PEOPLE?
WHY DO WE HAVE THE HIGHEST RATE OF CHILDHOOD POVERTY?
WHY ARE KIDS GRADUATING COLLEGE DEEPLY IN DEBT?
THIS IS THE WEALTHIEST COUNTRY IN HISTORY.
DO YOU REALLY WANT TO LIVE IN A COUNTRY LIKE THIS?
I THINK THAT IS THE REALITY THAT PEOPLE ARE SEEING.
AND THEY ARE SAYING ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.
COME TO THE RALLIES THAT WE DO, WE HAVE 10, 20,000 PEOPLE.
YOU SEE THE HOPE IN PEOPLE'S EYES THAT WE CAN, AS A
NATION, DO A LOT BETTER.
WE HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT THE MEDIA HERE. GOOD.
ONE OF THE THINGS THEY SAY IS THAT IT IS UNREALISTIC.
YOU JUST MENTIONED THAT ALL THE OTHER DEVELOPED COUNTRIES HAVE
SINGLE-PAYER HEALTHCARE AND HAVE ALL THE THINGS YOU MENTIONED.
SO WHY DO YOU THINK THAT THE MEDIA IS SAYING IT IS UNREALISTIC?
FIRST OF ALL, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE CORPORATE MEDIA.
LET ME CONGRATULATE YOU BECAUSE WE NEED TO BREAK THROUGH THE
FOG OF THE CORPORATE MEDIA, WHICH DOES EVERYTHING THAT THEY CAN
TO KEEP US ENTERTAINED WITHOUT ADDRESSING THE REAL ISSUES.
I AM IN THE CORPORATE MEDIA EVERY SINGLE DAY.
YOU DON'T KNOW HOW HARD IT IS JUST TO TRY AND DEMAND FOR
THEM TO BEGIN TO TALK ABOUT THE REAL ISSUES.
THEY TALK ABOUT EVERYTHING UNDER THE SUN, BUT NOT THE REAL ISSUES.
I THINK WHAT YOU HAVE IS A CORPORATE MEDIA WHICH,
BY DEFINITION, HAS CONFLICT OF INTEREST.
COMCAST OWNS NBC. DISNEY IS A CO-OWNER.
THEY ARE BRINGING IN PEOPLE FROM AROUND THE WORLD TO REPLACE
AMERICAN WORKERS.
THESE ARE ISSUES THAT THEY DON'T WANT TO DISCUSS.
SECOND OF ALL, THE MODEL FOR MEDIA COVERAGE RIGHT NOW IS
SIX SECOND SOUNDBITES AND AN UNWILLINGNESS TO TALK ABOUT
THE REAL ISSUES IN A SERIOUS WAY.
FOR EXAMPLE, CLIMATE CHANGE.
I HAD TO WRITE A LETTER TO THE PRESIDENTS OF ALL THE
NETWORKS TO TELL THEM THEIR SUNDAY SHOWS, THEY NEVER
TALK ABOUT CLIMATE CHANGE.
WHY?
IT DOESN'T HAVE TO DO WITH THE FACT THAT THEY GET A LOT OF
OIL MONEY FOR ADVERTISING?
I THINK IT DOES.
INCOME AND WEALTH INEQUALITY, WE HAVEN'T HAD REALLY SERIOUS DISCUSSIONS.
HEALTHCARE ñ DID YOU SEE MICHAEL MOORE'S MOVIE CALLED SICKO?
YES I DID. IT WAS A BRILLIANT MOVIE.
BUT I TELL YOUNG PEOPLE, THEY DON'T EVEN KNOW THAT WE ARE
THE ONLY RICH COUNTRY THAT DOES NOT HAVE HEALTH CARE FOR ALL.
THEY DON'T KNOW THAT IN GERMANY, COLLEGE IS FREE.
THE MEDIA IS NOT TELLING THEM THAT.
THE MEDIA WANTS TO TALK ABOUT EVERYTHING IN THE
WORLD EXCEPT IMPORTANT ISSUES.
IF YOU TALK ABOUT REAL ISSUES, AND PEOPLE GET EDUCATED, DO
YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPENS NEXT?
THE ACTUALLY MAY WANT TO BRING ABOUT CHANGE.
DO YOU THINK YOU SEE NBC TALKING ABOUT CITIZENS UNITED?
I DON'T THINK SO. TELEVISION STATIONS MAKE A HUGE AMOUNT.
I WAS GOING TO ASK ABOUT THAT AS WELL.
BEFORE WE GET TO THAT, DO YOU THINK THAT TIME WARNER AND
COMCAST SHOULD HAVE TO DISCLOSE THAT THEY ARE AMONG THE TOP
10 DONORS TO HILLARY CLINTON'S CAMPAIGN THROUGHOUT HER CAREER?
YEAH.
THEY ARE DOING THE DEBATES, ELECTION NIGHT COVERAGE,
AND THEY NEVER SAY THAT WE ARE AMONG THE TOP DONORS.
ABSOLUTELY.
I THINK THEY FOCUS ON MEDIA ITSELF, AND I DON'T DO ENOUGH OF IT.
YEAH, I THINK THAT POINT IS RIGHT, BUT THE DEMAND HAS
GOT TO BE FOR THE MEDIA ñ THAT'S WHY YOU GUYS ARE DOING IT,
TRYING TO GO AROUND THE SYSTEM.
I WAS AT ARIZONA STATE UNIVERSITY THE OTHER DAY.
BEAUTIFUL CAMPUS, BEAUTIFUL KIDS.
I ASKED THEM, DO YOU UNDERSTAND THERE IS ONLY ONE COUNTRY
THAT DOESN'T HAVE HEALTHCARE?
CONCEPTS ON JUSTICE- LEARNING WHAT GOES ON AROUND THE REST
OF THE WORLD.
VERY LITTLE KNOWLEDGE, NEVER TALKED ABOUT IN CORPORATE MEDIA.
I WANT TO GIVE YOU SOME EXAMPLES OF WHAT THE MEDIA
HAS DONE TO YOU.
I HAVE GIVEN DOZENS OF THESE EXAMPLES ON THE SHOW, BUT I
WANT TO HAVE YOU REACT TO IT.
FOR EXAMPLE THERE IS A
HEADLINE AGAINST YOU IN THE WASHINGTON POST.
IT'S AMAZING.
THEN WE HAD CHRIS CUOMO ASKING YOU THESE QUESTIONS.
I WANT YOU TO PAY ATTENTION TO HOW MAY TIMES HE ASKED YOU
ABOUT HOW YOU ARE PUNISHING PEOPLE.
HOW YOU ARE PAYING FOR IT IS ACTUALLY PUNITIVE.
YOU ARE GOING TO PUNISH PEOPLE WHO MAKE MONEY.
YOU WANT TO PUNISH THE FINANCIAL DISTRICT.
YOU ARE GOING TO PUNISH AND WIND UP CHANGING THE IDEA OF AN
OPEN AND FREE ECONOMY BECAUSE YOU'RE GOING TO PUNISH THEM
FOR SPECULATING.
I BELIEVE THAT WE COUNTED FOUR PUNISHES IN THERE.
HOW COME THEY NEVER ASK, HEY, ARE YOU GOING TO PUNISH THE KIDS
IN THIS COUNTRY BY SPENDING $1 TRILLION IN THE GOVERNMENT HEALTHCARE ACT?
YOU ASKED EXACTLY THE RIGHT QUESTION. HERE IS THE STORY.
I HAVE BEEN MAYOR FOR EIGHT YEARS, CONGRESS FOR 16, U.S.
SENATE FOR NINE YEARS.
DO YOU KNOW HOW MANY TIMES PEOPLE IN THE MEDIA HAVE
SAID, BERNIE, WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO TO END POVERTY IN AMERICA?
WE HAVE 47 MILLION PEOPLE IN POVERTY.
WHAT YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT IT? THE ANSWER IS ZERO. NOT ONCE.
WHAT IS IMPORTANT IS NOT THAT THE MEDIA IS RIGHT WING OR
WHATEVER, IT IS THEY FRAME THE DISCUSSION.
THAT IS WHAT WE HAVE GOT TO BREAK THROUGH.
BY THE WAY, IF YOU THINK THIS IS THE WORST, HE IS NOT.
THERE ARE A LOT OF OTHER PEOPLE WHO ARE A LOT MORE
CONSERVATIVE THAN CHRIS.
ON THIS ISSUE, WHAT CHRIS COULD'VE SAID WAS, BERNIE,
IN THE LAST 30 YEARS AS YOU KNOW, TRILLIONS OF DOLLARS HAVE
BEEN IN A MASSIVE REDISTRIBUTION OF WEALTH.
TRILLIONS OF DOLLARS HAVE GONE FROM THE HANDS OF THE
MIDDLE CLASS INTO THE ONE PERCENT.
BERNIE, THIS IS AN OUTRAGE. WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT THAT?
THAT WASN'T QUITE THE QUESTION I WAS ASKED.
DO YOU KNOW HOW OFTEN I AM ASKED THAT? ZERO.
MY IDEALS ARE RADICAL.
BUT IT IS NOT RADICAL WHEN WALL STREET, WHOSE ILLEGAL
BEHAVIOR NEARLY DESTROYED THIS ECONOMY, GETS BAILED OUT.
IT'S JUST THE WAY WE DO THINGS.
BUT TO TRY TO HELP THEIR CHILDREN, OR YOUNG PEOPLE
AFFORD TO GO TO COLLEGE, THAT IS UNREALISTIC.
I HAVE ONE MORE. THIS ONE IS ANDERSON COOPER.
AGAIN, LOOK AT THE FRAMING HERE.
I AM GOING TO ASK YOU TO RESPOND TO IT.
AGAIN, THIS IS CNN OWNED BY TIME WARNER.
THIS IS FOUR QUESTIONS IN A ROW, WE CUT OUT YOUR ANSWERS.
THEY ARE ALL ON CASTRO IN CUBA. LET ME ASK YOU ABOUT CUBA.
OBAMA IS IN CUBA RIGHT NOW, A HISTORIC VISIT.
AS PRESIDENT, WOULD YOU ALSO MAKE HISTORY?
WOULD YOU INVITE RAUL CASTRO IF HE IS STILL THE LEADER OF
CUBA TO THE WHITE HOUSE?
TO NORMALIZE RELATIONS, TO YOU THAT WOULD MEAN INVITING A
LEADER LIKE RAUL CASTRO TO THE WHITE HOUSE?
THE MODERATORS PLAYED A VIDEO OF YOU FROM 1985
IN WHICH YOU PRAISED FIDEL CASTRO.
YOU SAID HE EDUCATED THEIR KIDS, GAVE THEM HEALTHCARE,
TRANSFORMED THEIR SOCIETY.
DO YOU THINK THE CUBAN REVOLUTION WAS GOOD FOR THE
PEOPLE OF CUBA?
TODAY, CLINTON WENT AFTER YOU FOR, IN HER WORDS,
ESSENTIALLY PRAISING THE REGIME OF FIDEL CASTRO.
WHAT WE GET FRUSTRATED ABOUT FROM TIME TO TIME, IS THAT
THERE IS NOT ADEQUATE FOLLOW-UP QUESTIONS IN THE MEDIA.
SO TED CRUZ MIGHT SAY, I AM GOING TO REBUILD THE MILITARY,
AND NO ONE EVER ASKED, HOW ARE YOU GOING TO PAY FOR IT?
BUT THERE YOU GOT THREE FOLLOW-UP QUESTIONS, ALL ON
CASTRO AND CUBA, IN AN EFFORT TO FRAME YOU WITH THAT ñ
AT THE TIME THE FLORIDA ELECTION WAS TAKING PLACE, BY THE WAY.
THAT'S RIGHT.
THE REPUBLICANS HAVE DONE A PRETTY GOOD JOB OF FIGHTING THE MEDIA.
THEY SAY YOU HAVE A LIBERAL BIAS, THEN THEY GET SCARED
AND ASK THEM ABOUT WHAT TYPES OF PI—A COLADA'S THEY DRINK,
AND HOW NICE THEY ARE TO THEIR WIVES, LITERALLY THE
QUESTION THAT ANDERSON COOPER ASKED TED CRUZ AND THE OTHERS.
SHOULD YOU FIGHT BACK EVEN HARDER?
SAY THAT YOU ARE BIASED AGAINST ME?
I'LL GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE.
2 HOURS AGO I DID AN INTERVIEW ON PBS, AND I HAD A FIGHT
WITH THEM, BECAUSE I COULD SEE WHERE THE DISCUSSION WAS GOING.
I WAS GOING TO GET TRAPPED IN LITTLE STUFF THERE.
I HAD TO FIGHT BACK AND TAKE OVER THAT DISCUSSION TO TALK ABOUT
WHAT MY CAMPAIGN IS ABOUT.
I HAVE TO DO THAT VERY OFTEN, MAYBE I SHOULD DO IT MORE OFTEN.
I HAVE TO SAY SHUT UP, WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT IS
IRRELEVANT TO WHERE THE AMERICAN PEOPLE ARE.
MAYBE I SHOULD DO THAT, BUT TRUST ME, VIRTUALLY EVERY
INTERVIEW THAT WE DO WE HAVE TO FIGHT.
ON THIS ONE I ENDED UP DOING, WHAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT IS
WHETHER OR NOT WE THINK IT IS PROPER FOR THE UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT
TO GO AROUND OVERTHROWING GOVERNMENTS. BUT, YOU KNOW.
AND THE FRAMING SETS IT UP FOR THE AUDIENCE, AND SO THAT
IS WHY THAT IS IMPORTANT.
LET'S MOVE ON TO THE ISSUE OF ELECTABILITY AND HOW THE
MEDIA HAS COVERED THAT AS WELL.
THIS WILL BE THE LAST MEDIA QUESTION.
WE HAVE COVERED ALL THE DIFFERENT POLLS,
BECAUSE THAT IS WHAT WE DO, WE COVER THE NEWS HERE.
LET ME SHOW YOU HOW YOU DID IN THE LAST TWO POLLS, BUT I CAN
GO BACK AT LEAST A DOZEN POLLS AND GIVE YOU THE SAME RESULTS.
IN A POLL THAT JUST CAME OUT, HILLARY CLINTON DOES PRETTY
WELL AGAINST DONALD TRUMP, SHE IS BEATING HIM 46 ñ 40.
YOU AGAINST DONALD TRUMP, IT APPEARS YOU HAVE A
SIGNIFICANTLY LARGER LEAD.
WHAT IS THAT, FOURTEEN POINTS AS OPPOSED TO THE SIX-POINT LEAD SHE HAD?
LETS GO AGAINST TED CRUZ, SHE HAS A THREE-POINT LEAD,
ALMOST WITHIN THE MARGIN OF ERROR, YOU HAVE AN ELEVEN POINT LEAD
AGAINST THE SAME TED CRUZ.
IT IS NOT AN OUTLIER, THIS IS NOT THE SAME POLL, I WILL SHOW
YOU A CNN POLL.
HILLARY CLINTON IS BEATING DONALD TRUMP BY TWELVE POINTS.
ARE YOU GOING TO DO AS WELL IN A CNN POLL?
YOU ARE BEATING HIM BY TWENTY POINTS.
AND THEN YOU GO TO HILLARY CLINTON VERSUS TED CRUZ,
SHE IS TIED WITH TED CRUZ.
THAT IS SCARY BUSINESS ISN'T IT?
YOU ARE BEATING TED CRUZ BY THIRTEEN POINTS.
I'M GOING TO SHOW YOU ONE MORE CLIP FROM THE MEDIA, BECAUSE
THEY TALKED ABOUT YOUR
ELECTABILITY ON AIR ON CNN, AND I BELIEVE THIS IS CLIP 8.
LET'S LISTEN TO ANDERSON COOPER TELL THE AMERICAN PEOPLE WHO IS
MORE ELECTABLE.
BERNIE HAS A VERY POWERFUL MESSAGE, BUT I THINK A LOT
OF THE PEOPLE WHO VOTE FOR HIM WANT TO SEND A MESSAGE
RATHER THAN PICK A PRESIDENT.
THIS IS JUST A THEORY, BUT IT MAY BE THAT THE TALK OF VIOLENCE
AND THE VIOLENCE AT TRUMP RALLIES SETS UP FOR DEMOCRATS
THAT WE NEED TO PICK A PRESIDENT AND NOT JUST SEND A MESSAGE.
DEMOCRATS MOSTLY THINK HILLARY CLINTON IS A STRONGER CANDIDATE.
I WONDER IF THE LEVEL OF SERIOUSNESS IN THE CAMPAIGN
ON THE DEMOCRATIC SIDE ñ
IT WOULD BE INTERESTING TO SEE IF ELECTABILITY GETS
HIGHER THAN SHARES BY VALUES.
THAT IS INTERESTING BECAUSE ANDERSON COOPER
SEEMED TO SUGGEST AT THE END THAT HILLARY CLINTON IS
MORE ELECTABLE, EVEN THOUGH A CNN POLL SHOWED THE OPPOSITE.
DO YOU THINK THAT IS AN HONEST MISTAKE?
IT IS NOT AN HONEST MISTAKE.
YOU HAVE THE FACTS RIGHT IN FRONT OF THEM, AND THEY CAN
AVOID THE FACTS BASED ON IDEOLOGY.
AT THE END OF THE DAY, AND I SAY THIS WITHOUT ANY
DISRESPECT, HILLARY CLINTON IS THE ESTABLISHMENT CANDIDATE.
SHE IS THE ONE WHO IS GETTING $50 MILLION FROM WALL STREET,
HAS ALL THE GOVERNORS AND
SENATORS AND MEMBERS OF CONGRESS, ALL OF THEM.
THATíS WHAT THESE GUYS WANT.
THEY ARE SCARED TO DEATH, THEY GET SCARED TO DEATH AT THE
IDEA THAT YOUNG PEOPLE ARE ACTUALLY GETTING INVOLVED
IN THE POLITICAL PROCESS AND WANT CHANGE.
THE WORKING CLASS PEOPLE ARE SAYING WE NEED TO END THE
ESTABLISHMENT POLITICS AND ECONOMICS.
THAT IS THEIR NIGHTMARE, AND THAT IS WHAT YOU ARE SEEING THERE.
SENATOR SANDERS, ARE YOU CHARGING THAT THESE
MULTIBILLION-DOLLAR ORGANIZATIONS THAT RUN THE
MEDIA MIGHT BE PART OF THE ESTABLISHMENT?
THAT'S HEART WRENCHING, WHY DO YOU ASK ME SUCH DIFFICULT QUESTIONS?
THEY ARE THE ESTABLISHMENT.
AND MOST OF MY SPEECHES I SAY, LOOK, WE ARE TAKING ON
POWERFUL ECONOMIC INTERESTS ON WALL STREET.
WE ARE TAKING ON THE ENTIRE POLITICAL ESTABLISHMENT AND
WE'RE TAKING ON THE CORPORATE MEDIA, AND CORPORATE MEDIA
IS RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF THIS
IN ALL MY SPEECHES, WHAT I TELL PEOPLE IS, DO NOT ACCEPT THE
STATUS QUO OR THE OPTIONS.
SOMETIMES PEOPLE GO, WELL CENK, AS YOU KNOW, VERY LARGE
DEFICIT, WE HAVE TO CUT ñ
DO YOU THINK WE SHOULD CUT SOCIAL SECURITY OR MEDICARE?
THOSE ARE THE OPTIONS THAT YOU ARE GIVEN DAY IN AND DAY OUT,
RATHER THAN SAYING, ACTUALLY MAYBE WE SHOULD
ASK THE BILLIONAIRES TO START PAYING THEIR FAIR SHARE OF
TAXES, OR CLOSE TAX LOOPHOLES FOR CORPORATIONS.
NEVER PART OF THE DISCUSSION.
LETíS MOVE ON TO THOSE HARDER QUESTIONS.
A LOT OF PEOPLE IN THE MOVEMENT HAVE DECIDED THAT YOU ARE THEIR
LEADER, PARTLY BECAUSE YOU ARE RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT, BUT IF
YOU LOOK AT RECENT POLLS FROM MILLENNIAL'S THEY HAVE YOU AS BY
FAR THE MOST POPULAR POLITICIAN, BUT THEY ACTUALLY HAVE YOU AS
MORE POPULAR AS A PERSON THEY
WOULD LOVE TO MEET ABOVE BEYONC…. THAT IS A HELL OF A THING.
YOU HAVE CONVINCED THEM THAT HILLARY CLINTON IS THE
ESTABLISHMENT CANDIDATE.
IF YOU WERE TO LOSE, AND THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY COMES TO
YOU AND SAYS, NOW TAKE THIS MOVEMENT THAT IS FULL OF ENERGY
AND AGAINST THE ESTABLISHMENT, AND MAKE SURE THAT THEY
VOTE FOR THE ESTABLISHMENT CANDIDATE, WHAT DO YOU SAY?
WHAT I SAY ñ NUMBER ONE, I'M NOT INTO BEING THE LEADER,
I'D MUCH PREFER TO SEE A LOT OF LEADERS AND GRASSROOTS ACTIVISM.
NUMBER TWO, WHAT WE DO IS TOGETHER, AS A NATION, IS A
GROWING MOVEMENT.
WE SAY, IF WE DON'T WIN ñ BY THE WAY, WE ARE IN THIS THING TO WIN
ñ WHAT IS THE DEMOCRATIC ESTABLISHMENT GOING TO DO FOR US?
THAT'S INTERESTING.
FOR EXAMPLE, RIGHT NOW YOU HAVE A DEMOCRATIC ESTABLISHMENT WHICH
HAS WRITTEN OFF HALF THE STATES IN THIS COUNTRY, LITERALLY.
THEY HAVE GIVEN UP IN THE SOUTH, THE ROCKY MOUNTAIN AREA.
ARE THEY GOING TO CREATE A FIFTY STATE PARTY?
ARE THEY GOING TO WELCOME INTO THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY THE
WORKING CLASS IN THIS COUNTRY AND YOUNG PEOPLE, OR IS IT
GOING TO BE THE PARTY OF THE UPPER CLASS, THE COCKTAIL
CROWD AND THE HEAVY CAMPAIGN CONTRIBUTORS?
I HAVE TALKED TO DEMOCRATIC PARTY LEADERS WHO SAY, INSTEAD
OF GOING AROUND AND RAISING ALL KINDS OF MONEY, WHY DON'T YOU
BRING OUT 50,000 OR 100,000
PEOPLE, EVEN SENATE DEMOCRATS, AND START TALKING TO PEOPLE
AND ASK THEM WHAT YOU WANT THEM TO DO?
HOW ABOUT THAT?
IN OTHER WORDS, IF I CAN'T MAKE IT, AND WE'RE GOING TO TRY AS
HARD AS WE CAN UNTIL THE LAST
VOTE IS CAST, WE WANT TO COMPLETELY REVITALIZE THE
DEMOCRATIC PARTY AND MAKE IT THE PARTY OF THE PEOPLE, RATHER THAN JUST LARGE
CONTRIBUTORS.
NORMALLY POLITICIANS WANT TO ASK FOR SOMETHING FOR THEM.
CABINET POSTS, ETC.
I'M GOING TO ASSUME ñ
WHETHER YOU ARE GOING TO ASK FOR THAT OR NOT, YOU WON'T SAY
THAT HERE, LET'S ASSUME YOU ARE NOT GOING TO ASK FOR THAT.
IF YOU ARE GOING TO ASK FOR POLICY POSITIONS, AS YOU'VE
JUST INDICATED, WHAT ARE THE POLICY POSITIONS YOU WOULD WANT?
I WANT SECRETARY CLINTON, IF SHE IS THE NOMINEE,
TO COME OUT FOR A MEDICARE FOR ALL, SINGLE-PAYER HEALTH CARE SYSTEM.
I WANT FIFTEEN BUCKS AN HOUR AS MINIMUM WAGE, I WANT TO
REBUILD OUR CRUMBLING INFRASTRUCTURE.
FLINT, MICHIGAN IS NOT THE ONLY COMMUNITY IN AMERICA THAT
DOES NOT HAVE CLEAN DRINKING WATER.
I WANT A VIGOROUS EFFORT TO ADDRESS CLIMATE CHANGE.
I MEAN, I AM VERY WORRIED, I'M TALKING WITH SCIENTISTS,
THIS PLANET IS IN SERIOUS DANGER.
YOU CANNOT CUDDLE UP TO THE FOSSIL FUEL INDUSTRY, YOU
HAVE TO TAKE THEM ON.
WHAT IS RESONATING IS MAKING COLLEGES AND PUBLIC
UNIVERSITIES FREE, WALL STREET TAX ON SPECULATION TO PAY FOR THAT,
AND END CORPORATE LOOPHOLES. ALSO SOME OTHER LITTLE BITS.
IF THE CLINTON CAMPAIGN WERE TO PROMISE YOU THAT THEY
WOULD TAKE SIGNIFICANT ACTION IN SOME OF THOSE AREAS, WOULD
YOU BELIEVE THEM?
SHE SAYS NOW THAT SHE IS AGAINST THE TRANSPACIFIC PARTNERSHIP.
SHE HAD BEEN PREVIOUSLY IN FAVOR OF IT.
WHEN SHE BECOMES PRESIDENT, DO YOU REALLY BELIEVE THAT SHE
WILL MAINTAIN THIS POSITION AND BE AGAINST TPP, OR WILL SHE
FLIP AND SIGN THAT AGREEMENT?
YOU KNOW TOM DONOHUE, THE HEAD OF THE CHAMBER OF COMMERCE,
BASICALLY WHAT HE SAID IS, DON'T WORRY ABOUT WHAT SHE SAYS IN THE
CAMPAIGN, SHE IS JUST TRYING TO MATCH BERNIE SANDERS,
DON'T WORRY, IF SHE GETS ELECTED SHE WILL MAINTAIN THE SAME POLICIES.
WHAT I THINK WE NEED IS TO CREATE A MOVEMENT THAT WILL
HOLD ELECTED OFFICIALS ACCOUNTABLE.
HOW ABOUT MONEY IN POLITICS?
HERE IS A FAMILY THAT HAS RAISED $1 BILLION, BETWEEN BILL
AND HILLARY CLINTON, FOR THEIR CAMPAIGNS.
THEY HAVE RAISED $150 MILLION FOR THEMSELVES, PERSONALLY,
THROUGH PAID SPEECHES.
DO YOU BELIEVE A FAMILY THAT HAS BENEFITED SO MUCH FROM MONEY IN
POLITICS IS REALISTICALLY GOING TO FIGHT?
AND YOU ARE GOING TO NEED TO FIGHT REALLY HARD TO
GET MONEY OUT OF POLITICS.
ALL I CAN TELL YOU IS, I THINK THAT CITIZENS UNITED
IS ONE OF THE WORST DECISIONS EVER RENDERED BY A SUPREME
COURT IN AMERICAN HISTORY.
I THINK WE HAVE TO OVERTURN IT YESTERDAY, I THINK WE NEED
TO MOVE TO PUBLIC FUNDING OF ELECTIONS.
THAT IS ONE OF THE WAYS WE ARE REVITALIZING AMERICAN DEMOCRACY.
YOU HAVE ASKED A FAIR QUESTION, BUT I AM NOT GOING TO ANSWER IT RIGHT NOW.
YOU HAVE ASKED ME TO SPECULATE ON HER INTENTIONS, ALL I
CAN SAY IS THAT WE NEED ñ WIN OR LOSE FROM ME ñ
A POLITICAL REVOLUTION, WHICH STARTS ELECTING PEOPLE THAT
ARE ACCOUNTABLE FROM THE WORKING FAMILIES OF THIS COUNTRY.
MERRICK GARLAND HAS BEEN APPOINTED ñ
OR NOMINATED BY PRESIDENT OBAMA FOR THE SUPREME COURT.
HE SEEMED TO BACK CITIZENS UNITED.
SOME SAY THAT THAT PRECEDENT EXISTED, BUT HE WENT FURTHER AND SAID THERE
SHOULD BE UNLIMITED CONTRIBUTIONS.
YOU HAVE SAID THAT YOU WOULD HAVE PICKED SOMEONE ELSE.
IF HE DOES GET CONFIRMED, ARE YOU CONFIDENT THAT HE WOULD
BE AGAINST CITIZENS UNITED?
NO, I'M NOT.
I MEAN, BASED ON WHAT YOU JUST TOLD ME.
WHAT I HAVE SAID IS, THE PRESIDENT HAS THE RIGHT TO
NOMINATE WHOEVER HE WANTS, AND I
WILL SUPPORT THAT NOMINATION, AND WHAT THE REPUBLICANS
CONTINUE TO DO IS OBSTRUCT, AND THAT IS ABSOLUTELY WRONG.
BUT IF I AM ELECTED, AND IF GARLAND IS NOT SEATED, WHAT
I WOULD DO IS ASK HIM TO STEP ASIDE AND ASK THE
PRESIDENT TO WITHDRAW THE NOMINATION.
ARE YOU CONFIDENT THAT PRESIDENT OBAMA WOULD
WITHDRAW THE NOMINATION UNDER THOSE CIRCUMSTANCES?
WHO KNOWS, I THINK HE WOULD IF HE WAS NO LONGER PRESIDENT.
I WILL TELL YOU THIS, LET ME BE 100 PERCENT CLEAR, I WILL NOT
NOMINATE ANYBODY WHO IS NOT STRAIGHTFORWARD IN THE PUBLIC
ABOUT SAYING THAT PERSON, THAT NOMINEE WILL OVERTURN CITIZENS UNITED.
THAT IS MY LITMUS TEST.
HOW ABOUT PRESIDENT OBAMA HIMSELF?
DO YOU THINK HE HAS DONE ENOUGH TO GET MONEY OUT OF POLITICS?
NO.
I LIKE THE PRESIDENT, HE IS AN INCREDIBLY SMART GUY.
HE HAS FACED MORE OBSTRUCTIONISM,
AND OBVIOUSLY BECAUSE OF THE COLOR OF HIS SKIN HE HAS FACED
DISGUSTING OPPOSITION THAT IS DISGRACEFUL.
I THINK THAT MONEY IN POLITICS IS THE MAJOR POLITICAL CRISIS
THAT WE FACE RIGHT NOW, AND I THINK HE COULD HAVE DONE MORE.
HE IS CLEARLY AGAINST CITIZENS UNITED, NO QUESTION ABOUT
THAT, BUT I THINK HE COULD HAVE BEEN MORE FORTHRIGHT AND
STRONGER IN HIS OPPOSITION.
DO YOU THINK PRESIDENT OBAMA IS THE ESTABLISHMENT OR
FIGHTING AGAINST THE ESTABLISHMENT?
I THINK PROBABLY BOTH.
DO I THINK HE HAS REAL VIEWS AND REAL CONCERNS THAT ARE DEEPLY FELT?
I THINK HE DOES.
UNLIKE SOME PEOPLE, I THINK, FOR EXAMPLE, CLOSING GUANT¡NAMO, NOT
A POPULAR DECISION, I THINK HE DOES BELIEVE IT IN HIS HEART.
I THINK HE GETS VERY DISTURBED ABOUT THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE WE HAVE IN JAIL.
IT WAS BRAVE OF HIM TO GO TO THE JAIL, FIRST PRESIDENT OF
ALL TIME TO ACTUALLY VISIT A PENITENTIARY.
I LIKE HIM, I THINK HE IS A DECENT GUY.
BUT ON THE OTHER HAND, AS HILLARY CLINTON REMINDS US,
HE ACTUALLY GOT MORE MONEY FROM WALL STREET THAN SHE DID.
THAT WAS HER EXCUSE, HEY I GOT MONEY FROM WALL STREET SAYS
HILLARY CLINTON, BUT BARACK OBAMA GOT MORE.
DO I THINK HE STOOD UP TO WALL STREET AS HE SHOULD HAVE?
AS I GO AROUND THE COUNTRY AND SPEAK TO PEOPLE,
NOTHING GETS PEOPLE ANGRIER THAN THE FACT THAT SOME KID GETS
CAUGHT WITH MARIJUANA TODAY, THAT KID GETS A PRISON RECORD, RIGHT?
BUT WHAT HAPPENS IF YOU ARE A BANKER ON WALL STREET AND YOU
DESTROY THE AMERICAN ECONOMY BECAUSE OF ILLEGAL ACTIVITY?
AND YOU PAY, BY THE WAY, IF YOU ARE GOLDMAN SACHS, YOU PAY
$5 BILLION IN FINES.
$5 BILLION IN A SETTLEMENT WITH THE GOVERNMENT, AND HOW
MANY OF THESE PEOPLE ARE GOING TO GET CRIMINAL RECORDS?
NONE. AND THAT SHOWS THE CORRUPTION.
THAT HAPPENED UNDER PRESIDENT BUSH, BUT ALSO PRESIDENT OBAMA.
THE PRESIDENT WILL TELL YOU, WHAT THEY DID WAS ATROCIOUS
AND HORRIBLE, IT WASN'T ILLEGAL. I'M NOT SO SURE.
HILLARY CLINTON HAS STARTED TO TURN ALREADY TO THE CENTER.
YOU CAN TELL THAT BECAUSE DURING THE DEBATES WITH YOU SHE
CONSTANTLY USED PRESIDENT OBAMA AS A SHIELD, AS YOU JUST ALLUDED TO.
OBAMA DID IT TOO, ARE YOU CRITICIZING OBAMA?
THERE'S A LOT OF REASONS YOU WOULD DO THAT FOR POLITICAL
REASONS IN A PRIMARY, AND YOU HAVE BEEN SLOWER TO CRITICIZE
PRESIDENT OBAMA THAN YOU HAVE IN THE PAST.
HAVING SAID THAT, IT APPEARS SHE IS NOW DONE WITH THAT.
BECAUSE AT HER APEC SPEECH SHE BRAGGED ABOUT HER POLICIES,
TO THE REPORTERS, BEING MORE MUSCULAR
THAN PRESIDENT OBAMA, AND SHE SAID SHE WOULD IMMEDIATELY
HAVE BENJAMIN NETANYAHU OVER TO THE WHITE HOUSE IF SHE IS PRESIDENT,
SETTING UP A CONTRAST BETWEEN HERSELF AND PRESIDENT OBAMA.
IT APPEARS SHE IS RUNNING TO WHAT WASHINGTON WILL CALL
CENTER, TO WHAT I WOULD CALL THE RIGHT, NOW THAT SHE THINKS
SHE IS ON TO A GENERAL ELECTION.
IS THAT CONDESCENDING THAT SHE THINKS SHE IS DONE WITH THE PRIMARIES?
AND WHAT DOES THAT TELL YOU ABOUT HILLARY CLINTON IF HER
POSITIONS ARE READY TO SHIFT DEPENDING ON THE POLITICS?
THAT HAS BEEN A CRITICISM OF HILLARY CLINTON FROM DAY ONE.
PEOPLE SAY, SHE IS RUNNING AGAINST BERNIE SANDERS,
SUDDENLY SHE IS AGAINST THE TPP,
SUDDENLY SHE IS AGAINST THE PIPELINE, SHE WANTS TO
RAISE THE MINIMUM WAGE, SUDDENLY SHE SOUNDS LIKE BERNIE SANDERS.
YOUR POINT IS, NOW SHE THINKS SHE IS MORE MODERATE.
IN TERMS OF ISRAEL, I COULD NOT
MAKE THE APEC, BUT MY SPEECH WAS VERY DIFFERENT THAN HILLARY CLINTON.
I AM 100 PERCENT A SUPPORTER OF ISRAEL'S RIGHT TO EXIST.
DO THEY REALLY QUESTION THAT WITH YOU?
YOU WERE THE FIRST JEWISH CANDIDATE TO EVER WIN A
PRIMARY IN AMERICAN HISTORY. YOU'VE WON TWELVE CONTESTS.
DO PEOPLE REALLY THINK, I'M NOT SURE IF YOU ARE
SUFFICIENTLY PRO-ISRAEL?
ON THE OTHER HAND, WHAT I UNDERSTAND, ON GAZA
UNEMPLOYMENT IS FORTY-FOUR PERCENT.
THAT COMMUNITY REMAINS IN DESTRUCTION, THERE IS MASSIVE PROBLEMS.
YOU CANNOT BE A PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES WITHOUT
UNDERSTANDING THAT.
I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU BRING PEACE TO THE MIDDLE EAST IF YOU
ARE JUST ONE-SIDED.
AS A JEWISH PERSON, I HAVE FOUND, AND THIS IS SO
DISTURBING, SO MANY SIMILARITIES BETWEEN PALESTINIANS AND JEWS.
PEOPLE CAN AND SHOULD GET ALONG.
I WAS AT A CONFERENCE MANY YEARS AGO WITH A NUMBER OF PEOPLE
FROM ARAB COUNTRIES, AND ISRAEL.
DO YOU KNOW WE TALKED ABOUT?
NOT POLITICS, WE TALKED ABOUT WATER, WHICH IS A HUGE
CRISIS IN THAT PART OF THE WORLD.
YOU HAD INTELLIGENT PEOPLE SITTING DOWN, WHAT DO WE DO,
HOW DO WE SOLVE THAT PROBLEM?
I THINK IT CAN BE DONE, BUT I WAS NOT HAPPY WITH THAT SPEECH.
BY THE WAY, YOU HAD MORE MUSLIMS VOTING FOR YOU IN PLACES
AND STATES LIKE MICHIGAN, ARE YOU PROUD THAT AS A JEWISH
CANDIDATE YOU GOT AN OVERWHELMING
MAJORITY OF MUSLIMS VOTING FOR YOU IN AMERICA?
I AM. THAT IS THE BEST OF AMERICA.
I SAT DOWN WITH LEADERS, WONDERFUL PEOPLE, GOOD PEOPLE.
WHAT WE HAVE GOT TO DO, AND I DON'T TELL YOU THAT WE HAVE ANY
MAGICAL SOLUTION.
CLEARLY THERE ARE AWFUL PEOPLE ON BOTH SIDES, WHO FOR THEIR OWN
POLITICAL GAINS ARE FORMING HATRED, AND THERE ARE VERY GOOD
PEOPLE ON BOTH SIDES.
WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THE AWFUL PEOPLE,
ARE YOU REFERRING TO TED CRUZ AND DONALD TRUMP?
NO, TO SAY THE LEAST, PROBABLY BENJAMIN NETANYAHU
WOULD NOT BE THE FIRST PERSON I WOULD INVITE IF I TOOK OFFICE.
WE SHOULD PROBABLY WRAP IT UP.
I WANT TO END BY ASKING YOU ABOUT WHAT YOU WOULD DO IF YOU WIN.
NUMBER ONE, THE CLINTON PEOPLE SAY, THE REPUBLICANS ARE
GOING TO FIGHT YOU TOOTH AND NAIL.
YOU THINK IF HILLARY CLINTON WINS THEY'RE GOING TO ROLL
OUT THE WELCOME MAT?
THEYíLL JUST LOVE HER.
OVER THE YEARS THEY HAVE SHOWN THEIR ENORMOUS RESPECT AND AFFECTION FOR HER.
I SUSPECT THEY WILL THROW SOME WONDERFUL PARTY.
LOOK, GIVEN THE SEVERITY OF THE CRISES THAT WE FACE RIGHT
NOW, WHAT HAS GOT TO HAPPEN, AND I DO NOT JUST USE THIS
RHETORICALLY, WE NEED A POLITICAL REVOLUTION.
I'M BEGINNING TO SEE THE SEEDS OF THAT DEVELOPING IN THIS
CAMPAIGN, WHERE WORKING-CLASS PEOPLE AND YOUNG PEOPLE
BEGIN TO UNDERSTAND THAT IT IS IMPERATIVE THAT THEY
PARTICIPATE IN THE POLITICAL PROCESS, AND THAT THEY DEMAND
A GOVERNMENT WHICH REPRESENTS ALL OF US, NOT JUST THE FEW.
THAT IS WHAT WE HAVE GOT TO DO, I CANNOT DO IT AS PRESIDENT ALONE.
WHAT DO YOU DO WITH THAT POLITICAL REVOLUTION IF YOU WIN?
HOW DO YOU GET THE REPUBLICANS TO GO IN THE DIRECTION YOU ARE ASKING FOR?
THE REPUBLICANS ARE MANY THINGS, BUT THEY ARE NOT
DUMB, AND THEY UNDERSTAND THAT THEIR AGENDA SUCCEEDS WHEN
NOBODY KNOWS WHAT THEIR AGENDA IS.
I'M A RANKING MEMBER OF THE BUDGET COMMITTEE.
HOW MANY AMERICANS DO YOU THINK KNOW THAT THESE GUYS WANT TO
CUT SOCIAL SECURITY, MEDICARE, CUT MEDICAID, CUT EDUCATION?
GIVE MILLIONS OF DOLLARS OF TAX BREAKS TO THE TOP ONE PERCENT?
DO YOU THINK ANYBODY IN AMERICA KNOWS THAT?
WHEN I AM PRESIDENT, THEY WILL KNOW.
YOU GET LEGISLATION INTRODUCED ñ ONE EXAMPLE, MAKE PUBLIC
COLLEGES AND UNIVERSITIES FREE WITH TAX ON WALL STREET SPECULATION.
THAT IS GOING TO COME UP ON SEPTEMBER 19, 2017,
AND EVERY PERSON IN THIS COUNTRY IS GOING TO KNOW THAT BILL,
AND THEY ARE GOING TO KNOW WHO IS VOTING FOR THAT BILL AND
WHO IS GOING TO BE AGAINST IT.
YOU DEVELOP GRASSROOTS ORGANIZATIONS. YOU FOCUS ATTENTION ON THAT.
YOU DEVELOP THE NEED FOR HEALTHCARE.
BUT YOU HAVE TO EDUCATE PEOPLE AND YOU HAVE TO BRING THE
GRASSROOTS IN MUCH CLOSER CONNECTION TO WHAT GOES ON IN CONGRESS.
IF YOU WIN, IS HILLARY CLINTON LIBERAL ENOUGH TO BE IN YOUR CABINET?
STOP GETTING ME IN TROUBLE.
THERE ARE OTHER PEOPLE THAT I WOULD PROBABLY GO TO BEFORE
HILLARY CLINTON.
PEOPLE LIKE ELIZABETH WARREN, FOR EXAMPLE.
ALL RIGHT, FAIR ENOUGH.
BERNIE SANDERS, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US ON THE
YOUNG TURKS, WE APPRECIATE IT.
WILL BE RIGHT BACK WITH THE REST OF THE SHOW, THANK YOU GUYS.