in historic buildings,

在歷史建築中。

a number of kind of common themes start to come through.

一些共同的主題開始出現。

One is looking at the combustible materials

一個是看可燃物

and the interior finishes

和內部裝修

and the overall structure being of combustible materials.

和整體結構為可燃材料。

It creates a lot of challenges for firefighters to really

這給消防員帶來了很大的挑戰，真正的

be able to protect these buildings.

能夠保護這些建築物。

My name is Chris Marrion.

我的名字是克里斯・馬瑞恩

I'm a fire and disaster management consultant.

我是一個火災和災難管理顧問。

In terms of, yes, fires

在，是的，火災

in historic buildings and structures,

在歷史建築和結構中。

they are fairly common not just in terms

他們不僅在

of there being a fire,

的有火。

but overall the extent of damage

但總體而言，損害程度

that then results once a fire does get started.

然後導致一旦起火。

And we've seen recently the Glasgow School of Arts fire,

而最近我們看到格拉斯哥藝術學校的火爆。

the second fire there that was during restoration.

那裡的第二次火災，是在修復期間。

We've seen it on a number of other buildings:

我們在其他一些建築上也看到過。

Troitsky Cathedral in Saint Petersburg,

聖彼得堡的特羅伊茨基大教堂。

Wangdue Phodrang Dzong in Bhutan.

不丹的旺堆普德朗宗。

One part is just looking at the overall construction

一部分是隻看整體建設

in terms of the structural elements.

在結構要素方面。

The wood trusses, the roof decking for instance.

比如說木桁架、屋面板。

Just regular interior finishes throughout these buildings

只是這些建築內部的常規裝修

that are a lot of times of wood.

那是很多時代的木頭。

When we first see some of these buildings,

當我們第一次看到這些建築的一些。

they look like stone-masonry-type construction.

他們看起來像石砌類建築。

It is noncombustible.

它是不可燃的。

Once going inside, you can see

進去之後，你可以看到

a lot of times the interior finishes,

很多時候內飾。

a lot are covered in woodwork.

很多都是覆蓋在木製品上。

The floors, the pews in churches and so forth

教堂裡的地板、長椅等等。

are all wood and combustible materials,

都是木材和可燃材料。

and then over time buildings

然後隨著時間的推移，建築物

continue to accumulate materials.

繼續積累材料。

Papers, whether it's artwork, all types of different things

紙張，不管是藝術品，各種不同類型的東西

that are actually combustible,

實際上是可燃的。

and they just continue over time to build up

他們只是繼續隨著時間的推移建立

and get placed throughout different areas of the building.

並被放置在建築物的不同區域。

Some of the other things that we run into

我們遇到的一些其他事情

is just looking at fire separations for instance.

是隻看火的分離，比如說。

There may not be a fire separation.

可能沒有防火隔離。

It may just be a large uncompartmented space

可能只是一個大的無隔斷空間而已

that would allow the fire to spread within that space

導致火勢在該空間內蔓延。

and to continue on kind of unchecked.

並繼續那種不受控制的。

They may have actually put in fire walls at times,

他們有時可能真的裝上了火牆。

but then over the years and centuries and so forth,

但後來經過幾年、幾百年等等。

doors may be removed for various reasons.

由於各種原因，門可能會被拆除。

One of the other things just to keep in mind too,

其他的一個東西也只是要記住。

you know, it's challenging to send

你知道，它的挑戰性發送

emergency responders into those spaces.

應急人員進入這些空間。

There's limited areas that they have to fight a fire from.

他們必須在有限的區域內滅火。

They have limited water supplies and hoses

他們的供水和水管有限

and those types of things.

和這些類型的東西。

So it's typically an externally fought fire,

所以，這是典型的外強中乾的火災。

and when you look at that,

而當你看到這一點。

a lot of these roofs in these older buildings

很多這些屋頂在這些老建築裡

are of slate, or lead, or copper,

是板岩、鉛或銅的。

different types of materials,

不同類型的材料。

which are intended to keep the water out.

其目的是為了防止水進入。

So spraying water on tops of these roofs,

所以在這些屋頂上面噴水。

they're not actually penetrating

他們並沒有真正滲透

into those upper attic spaces.

進入這些上層閣樓空間。

A lot of times when you do see fires in historic structures,

很多時候，當你看到歷史建築中的火災。

it is a lot during restoration periods.

在修復期間，它是很多。

For instance, Troitsky Cathedral in Russia

例如，俄羅斯的特羅伊茨基大教堂。

several years ago,

幾年前。

there was a fire during construction.

施工期間發生了火災。

Wangdue Phodrang Dzong in Bhutan had a fire

旺堆宗

just a few years ago as well too.

就在幾年前也。

There's a lot that's going on during that time

那段時間發生了很多事情。

that introduce hazards.

帶來危害的。

We have a lot of temporary electrical,

我們有很多臨時電。

temporary lighting in those.

臨時照明在這些。

We have hot works going on,

我們的工程正在熱火朝天地進行。

cutting torches and welding operations,

割炬和焊接操作。

and those types of things.

和這些類型的東西。

So there's a fair amount of new ignition sources

所以有不少新的點火源。

that are introduced there on a temporary basis.

在那裡臨時引進的。

We also can have a lot of combustible materials

我們也可以有很多的可燃物。

introduced at the site in terms of

在該地引進的

overall construction materials, potentially the scaffolding.

整體建築材料，可能是腳手架。

Those types of things that could be introduced on site.

這些類型的東西，可以在現場介紹。

So in terms of the fire, you know,

所以在火候方面，你知道。

the ignition potential could be increasing.

點火的可能性會越來越大。

On the mitigation side,

在緩解方面：

we often, the detection system may be being installed,

我們經常，檢測系統可能正在安裝。

or it may be covered over so that the dust and debris

或者可以覆蓋在上面，以便灰塵和碎屑。

isn't creating nuisance alarms.

並沒有製造騷擾性的警報。

And then on the fire separation side as well too,

然後在分火方面也是如此。

at times doors are taken off to be restored,

有時門會被取下進行修復。

and they're brought somewhere else.

他們被帶到別的地方去了。

I think there's definitely things that can be done

我想肯定有一些事情是可以做的。

to help improve the protection of these buildings.

以幫助改善對這些建築物的保護。

I think over the years, people have been living,

我想，這些年來，人們一直在生活。

working, going to services in these buildings for years,

工作，多年來在這些建築中去服務。

and these buildings have lasted for centuries at times,

而這些建築有時已經持續了幾個世紀。

and there kind of gets this perception

並有種得到這種看法

that, "Well, we haven't had a fire. Therefore, we're safe,

"我們沒有發生過火災是以，我們是安全的。

and this is protected, and we're OK."

而這是受保護的，我們就可以了。"

But it really is just having an ignition source

但其實就是有一個點火源而已

close to something that's combustible,

靠近可燃物的東西。

and just having that opportunity

而只是有這樣的機會

that something does ignite

火上澆油

and has the opportunity to expand from there.

並有機會從中拓展。

So just because it hasn't happened

所以就因為它沒有發生

doesn't mean that is it fireproof for instance,

並不意味著它是防火的，例如。

and I think we need to remember that.

我認為我們需要記住這一點。