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  • Translator: Joseph Geni Reviewer: Morton Bast

    如你所想的,我對舞蹈很有熱情。

  • As you might imagine, I'm absolutely passionate

    我熱衷創作舞蹈、

  • about dance. I'm passionate about making it,

    熱衷欣賞舞蹈,

  • about watching it, about encouraging others

    也熱衷鼓勵別人參與其中。

  • to participate in it,

    我對創造力也很有熱情。

  • and I'm also really passionate about creativity.

    對我來說,創造力是至關重要的。

  • Creativity for me is something that's absolutely critical,

    我認為創造力是可以教的,

  • and I think it's something that you can teach.

    我認為創造力技巧是可以傳授、分享的。

  • I think the technicities of creativity can be taught

    我認為你可以找到專屬自己的身體符號、

  • and shared, and I think you can find out things

    認知習慣,

  • about your own personal physical signature,

    並以此為出發點,好好地「胡鬧」一番。

  • your own cognitive habits, and use that as

    我出生於 1970 年代,

  • a point of departure to misbehave beautifully.

    當時約翰屈伏塔可是個大人物, 像是《火爆浪子》、《週六夜瘋狂》。

  • I was born in the 1970s, and John Travolta was big

    他提供了很棒的男性榜樣,讓我開始跳舞。

  • in those days: "Grease," "Saturday Night Fever,"

    我的父母總是讓我做決定,

  • and he provided a fantastic kind of male role model for me

    他們全力地鼓勵我出發去冒險、

  • to start dancing. My parents were very up for me going.

    去嘗試,再嘗試。

  • They absolutely encouraged me to take risks, to go,

    過去我有個機會在當地的舞蹈教室上課,

  • to try, to try. I had an opportunity, an access

    且我的老師很有啟發性。

  • to a local dance studio, and I had an enlightened teacher

    她允許我自己獨立創編舞蹈。

  • who allowed me to make up my own and invent

    她所做的是

  • my own dances, so what she did was let me make up

    讓我自己編國標和拉丁舞,

  • my own ballroom and Latin American dances to teach

    教給我的同儕。

  • to my peers.

    那是我第一次有機會

  • And that was the very first time that I found an opportunity

    感受到我可以表達自己的心聲。

  • to feel that I was able to express my own voice,

    這激勵了我日後成為一位編舞者。

  • and that's what's fueled me, then, to become a choreographer.

    我覺得我有東西要說,有東西要分享。

  • I feel like I've got something to say and something to share.

    我想有趣的地方在於,

  • And I guess what's interesting is, is that I am now obsessed

    現在我對肢體的技巧非常著迷。

  • with the technology of the body.

    我認為這是我們最擅長的溝通傳達技巧。

  • I think it's the most technologically literate thing that we have,

    我完全著迷於

  • and I'm absolutely obsessed with finding a way

    尋找一種透過肢體 向觀眾表達理念的方式,

  • of communicating ideas through the body to audiences

    來感動他們、觸動他們的心、

  • that might move them, touch them,

    幫助他們用不同角度思考。

  • help them think differently about things.

    所以對我來說, 編舞是一種物理性思考。

  • So for me, choreography is very much a process

    這過程存在於腦中,

  • of physical thinking. It's very much in mind,

    也存在於身體,是一種合作式的過程。

  • as well as in body, and it's a collaborative process.

    是必須和別人合作完成的事。

  • It's something that I have to do with other people.

    某種程度上說,是種分散的認知過程。

  • You know, it's a distributed cognitive process in a way.

    我常和設計師和視覺藝術家一起工作,

  • I work often with designers and visual artists,

    當然還有舞者和其他的編舞家,

  • obviously dancers and other choreographers,

    但現在,我有更多的機會是和經濟學家、

  • but also, more and more, with economists,

    人類學家、神經學家,認知科學家

  • anthropologists, neuroscientists, cognitive scientists,

    和許多來自不同領域的專家一起合作。

  • people really who come from very different domains of

    他們把不同領域的智慧

  • expertise, where they bring their intelligence to bear

    運用在不同的創新過程。

  • on a different kind of creative process.

    而今天我們要做的是稍稍探索一下

  • What I thought we would do today a little bit is

    物理性思考這個想法。

  • explore this idea of physical thinking,

    我們都是物理性思考的專家,

  • and we're all experts in physical thinking.

    我們都有軀體,對吧?

  • Yeah, you all have a body, right?

    我們都知道身體在現實世界是怎樣的,

  • And we all know what that body is like in the real world,

    物理性思考的其中一個面向

  • so one of the aspects of physical thinking

    就是「本體感受」這概念,

  • that we think about a lot is this notion of proprioception,

    就是自己的身體在真實空間中的感覺。

  • the sense of my own body in the space in the real world.

    我們都了解

  • So, we all understand what it feels like to know

    當你敞開雙臂,

  • where the ends of your fingers are

    知道自己手指在哪的感覺。

  • when you hold out your arms, yeah?

    你絕對知道你什麼時候要拿杯子、

  • You absolutely know that when you're going to grab a cup,

    或要把移動了的杯子重新擺好。

  • or that cup moves and you have to renavigate it.

    我們早已是物理性思維的專家,

  • So we're experts in physical thinking already.

    我們只是不常意識到我們的身體。

  • We just don't think about our bodies very much.

    我們只有在身體出問題時才想到,

  • We only think about them when they go wrong, so, when

    比如手骨折或是心臟病發的時候,

  • there's a broken arm, or when you have a heart attack,

    你才會真正意識到你的身體。

  • then you become really very aware of your bodies.

    但我們如何將編舞的思維、

  • But how is it that we can start to think about using

    動覺智能

  • choreographic thinking, kinesthetic intelligence, to arm

    運用在一般性的思考當中呢?

  • the ways in which we think about things more generally?

    我接下要做的是一場 TED 首演。

  • What I thought I'd do is, I'd make a TED premiere.

    我不知道這會不會成功,

  • I'm not sure if this is going to be good or not.

    就姑且一試。

  • I'll just be doing it.

    我要做的是,

  • I thought what I'd do is, I'd use three versions

    用三種物理性思維模式來做些事情。

  • of physical thinking to make something.

    向您介紹,這是保歐羅,這是卡特琳娜。

  • I want to introduce you. This is Paolo. This is Catarina.

    (掌聲)

  • (Applause)

    他們完全不知道接下來要做什麼。

  • They have no idea what we're going to do.

    這不像一般的編舞,

  • So this is not the type of choreography where

    通常我會先計畫好要做什麼,

  • I already have in mind what I'm going to make,

    並先在腦中設計一套固定舞步

  • where I've fixed the routine in my head

    再教給他們,

  • and I'm just going to teach it to them,

    這些所謂的「白紙」只要學習就好,

  • and these so-called empty vessels are just going to learn it.

    這完全不是我們要用的方法。

  • That's not the methodology at all that we work with.

    整體的重點是他們如何

  • But what's important about it is how it is that they're

    掌握資訊,接受資訊,

  • grasping information, how they're taking information,

    使用資訊,及思考這些資訊。

  • how they're using it, and how they're thinking with it.

    我將簡單地開始。

  • I'm going to start really, really simply.

    通常舞蹈需要一個或多個刺激元素。

  • Usually, dance has a stimulus or stimuli, and I thought

    我要用簡單的東西, 這個 TED 標誌,我們都能看到它,

  • I'd take something simple, TED logo, we can all see it,

    很容易利用,而我要做的也很簡單。

  • it's quite easy to work with, and I'm going to do something

    我們先從某軀體來獲得一個想法,

  • very simply, where you take one idea from a body,

    這身體剛好是我的身體,然後把那個想法

  • and it happens to be my body, and translate that

    轉移到別人身上,

  • into somebody else's body,

    這是一種直接轉移、是能量的轉換。

  • so it's a direct transfer, transformation of energy.

    我將如此想像,如果您願意也可以照著做。

  • And I'm going to imagine this, you can do this too if you like,

    我只用字母"T",

  • that I'm going to just take the letter "T" and I'm going

    先在心中想像它, 然後把它往外置於現實世界,

  • to imagine it in mind, and I'm going to place that outside in

    所以我絕對有看到一個字母"T"在我前面。

  • the real world. So I absolutely see a letter "T" in front of me.

    有吧?它絕對在那,

  • Yeah? It's absolutely there.

    當我看到它,我能繞著它走,對吧?

  • I can absolutely walk around it when I see it, yeah?

    它有某種語法,我知道如何使用它,

  • It has a kind of a grammar. I know what I'm going to do

    所以我可以開始描述它, 我可以簡單描述它,

  • with it, and I can start to describe it, so I can describe it

    我可以用我的手臂描述它,

  • very simply. I can describe it in my arms, right?

    所以我做的是用我的手, 然後移動我的手。

  • So all I did was take my hand and then I move my hand.

    我可以描述它,用我的頭,你知道嗎?

  • I can describe it, whoa, in my head, you know? Whoa.

    也可用我的肩,瞧?

  • Okay. I can do also my shoulder. Yeah?

    它讓我有事可做,讓我發揮作用。

  • It gives me something to do, something to work towards.

    要是我把字母"T"平放在地,

  • If I were to take that letter "T" and flatten it down

    這裡,也許就是這裡,

  • on the floor, here, maybe just off the floor,

    我或許可以突然用我的膝蓋,

  • all of a sudden I could do maybe something with my knee,

    如果我膝蓋和手臂並用,

  • yeah? Whoa. So If I put the knee and the arms together,

    就得到某種有形的東西,開始建立某物。

  • I've got something physical, yeah? And I can start to build something.

    接下來我要做的大約一分半鐘左右,

  • So what I'm going to do just for one and a half minutes or so

    我要用這概念要做點什麼。

  • is I'm going to take that concept, I'm going to make something,

    我身後的舞者將詮釋這概念,

  • and the dancers behind me are going to interpret it,

    他們要快速理解,並採取自己的觀點。

  • they're going to snapshot it, they're going to take

    有點像我在卸載記憶,

  • aspects of it, and it's almost like I'm offloading memory

    而他們在承接記憶,可以嗎?

  • and they're holding onto memory? Yeah?

    我們來看可迸出怎樣的火花。

  • And we'll see what we come up with.

    我們可以稍微看一下他們是如何

  • So just have a little watch about how they're, how they're

    存取記憶和怎麼做。

  • accessing this and what they're doing,

    我將用字母"T"、"E"

  • and I'm just going to take this letter "T," the letter "E,"

    和"D"做點什麼。好吧。就是這樣。

  • and the letter "D," to make something. Okay. Here goes.

    我要讓自己進入狀態,可以嗎?

  • So I have to get myself in the zone. Right.

    一些手臂的交叉。

  • It's a bit of a cross of my arm.

    我所做的是探討"T"的空間,

  • So all I'm doing is exploring this space of "T"

    並透過行動來反射這空間。

  • and flashing through it with some action.

    我不記得我做了什麼。

  • I'm not remembering what I'm doing.

    我只是在做我的任務,而任務是"T"。

  • I'm just working on my task. My task is this "T."

    我要從旁邊來看,哇。

  • Going to watch it from the side, whoa.

    攻擊時刻。

  • Strike moment.

    就是這樣。

  • That's it.

    所以我們開始建立一個舞句。

  • So we're starting to build a phrase.

    我們來看看他們做了什麼。

  • So what they're doing, let's see, something like that,

    他們所做的是去理解動作的觀點,

  • so what they're doing is grasping aspects of that movement

    然後將它創造成一個舞句。

  • and they're generating it into a phrase.

    您可以看到的速度非常快,是吧?

  • You can see the speed is extremely quick, yeah?

    我並非要求他們要完全複製,

  • I'm not asking them to copy exactly.

    他們要用收到的資訊

  • They're using the information that they receive

    產成一個舞句的開端。

  • to generate the beginnings of a phrase.

    我可以觀察並得知

  • I can watch that and that can tell me something

    舞者們如何移動。

  • about how it is that they're moving.

    他們動作超級快,對吧?

  • Yeah, they're super quick, right?

    我詮釋 TED 的觀點,

  • So I've taken this aspect of TED and translated it

    並將它轉化成有形的事物。

  • into something that's physical.

    有些舞者觀察動作時

  • Some dancers, when they're watching action,

    採用整體形式,即移動的弧線、

  • take the overall shape, the arc of the movement,

    運動知覺的移動,

  • the kinetic sense of the movement,

    並以此作為記憶。

  • and use that for memory.

    有些則著重在具體細節,

  • Some work very much in specific detail.

    從小單位開始然後慢慢建立。

  • They start with small little units and build it up.

    好的,都理解了嗎?再來。

  • Okay, you've got something? One more thing.

    他們正在為我解決這個問題。

  • So they're solving this problem for me,

    有一點──

  • having a little --

    他們正在建構這舞句,

  • They're constructing that phrase.

    他們有些想法要緊緊抓住。

  • They have something and they're going to hold on to it,

    可以嗎?一種創作方法。

  • yeah? One way of making.

    這將是我在世界首演的開端。

  • That's going to be my beginning in this world premiere.

    好,現在我要來點不一樣的。

  • Okay. From there I'm going to do a very different thing.

    簡單來說,我要來個雙人舞。

  • So basically I'm going to make a duet.

    我要你們把舞者看成結構物體,

  • I want you to think about them as architectural objects,

    他們只是純粹的線條,

  • so what they are, are just pure lines.

    不再是人,只是線條,然後我會

  • They're no longer people, just pure lines, and I'm going

    把他們視為物體來合作,可以嗎?

  • to work with them almost as objects to think with, yeah?

    我現在想

  • So what I'm thinking about is taking

    當我移動時,做幾個身體的延展,

  • a few physical extensions from the body as I move, and

    我移動的同時也提示他們一些事情,

  • I move them, and I do that by suggesting things to them:

    如果,就這樣 ;如果,就那樣。開始吧。

  • If, then; if, then. Okay, so here we go.

    抓住這個手臂,

  • Just grab this arm.

    你可以往下放到地上嗎?

  • Can you place that down into the floor?

    對,到地上。可以鑽到底下嗎?

  • Yeah, down to the floor. Can you go underneath?

    卡特,可以把腿跨到這邊嗎?

  • Yeah. Cat, can you put leg over that side? Yeah.

    你可以旋轉嗎?

  • Can you rotate?

    再從頭開始。

  • Whoom, just go back to the beginning.

    開始囉,準備好嗎?

  • Here we go, ready? And ... bam, bake ... (clicks metronome)

    很好。你們兩位都站起來。

  • Great. Okay, from there, you're both getting up.

    都起身。他們很棒吧?

  • You're both getting up. Here we go. Good, now? Them.

    (掌聲)

  • (Applause)

    從那裡,從那裡,我們都起身,

  • So from there, from there, we're both getting up,

    都起身往這邊。

  • we're both getting up, going in this direction,

    往下,往下,

  • going underneath. Whoa, whoa, underneath.

    往下,可以嗎?往下。往前跳。

  • Whoa, underneath, whoo-um. Yeah? Underneath. Jump.

    往下、往前跳。保歐羅,踢。儘管踢。

  • Underneath. Jump. Paolo, kick. Don't care where. Kick.

    踢、站好、換腿。踢、站好、換腿。

  • Kick, replace, change a leg. Kick, replace, change the leg.

    可以嗎?卡特,幾乎碰到他的頭。 幾乎碰到他的頭。

  • Yeah? Okay? Cat, almost get his head. Almost get his head.

    也許再後面些,

  • Whoaa. Just after it, maybe. Whoaa, whaaay, ooh.

    扶她的腰部,起身,旋轉,

  • Grab her waist, come up back into her first, whoom, spin,

    把她轉身,很好。

  • turn her, whoo-aa. (Snaps) Great.

    好,讓我們從頭開始。

  • Okay, let's have a little go from the beginning of that.

    讓我稍微慢下來。想像有八...(笑聲)

  • Just, let me slow down here. Fancy having eight -- (Laughter)

    一天有八小時這些想像都在我腦海中,

  • Fancy having eight hours with me in a day.

    也許太多了。準備好,開始。

  • So, maybe too much. So, here we go, ready, and -- (Clicks metronome)

    (打拍子)

  • (Clicks metronome)

    很好,做得好。是吧?(掌聲)

  • Nice, good job. Yeah? Okay. (Applause)

    好,還不錯。(掌聲)再來一些?

  • Okay, not bad. (Applause) A little bit more?

    好,再來一些。我們從這開始。

  • Yeah. Just a little bit more, here we go, from that place.

    分開,面對前面。分開,面對前面。

  • Separate. Face the front. Separate. Face the front.

    想像有個圈圈在你前面

  • Imagine that there's a circle in front of you, yeah?

    繞過它,繞過它,把它踢出去,

  • Avoid it. Avoid it. Whoom. Kick it out of the way.

    把它踢出去。把它扔向觀眾。

  • Kick it out of the way. Throw it into the audience. Whoom.

    再丟一次。

  • Throw it into the audience again.

    我們有個心理結構,分享它

  • We've got mental architecture, we're sharing it,

    因而解決問題。他們正這樣做。

  • therefore solving a problem. They're enacting it.

    讓我看一下。預備,開始。

  • Let me just see that a little bit. Ready, and go.

    (打拍子)

  • (Clicks metronome)

    太棒了。再來一次。

  • Okay, brilliant. Okay, here we go. From the beginning,

    可以先跳我們的舞句?然後再這樣。

  • can we do our phrases first? And then that.

    我們正在建立及組織

  • And we're going to build something now, organize it,

    這些舞句。開始。很好,慢慢來?

  • the phrases. Here we go. Nice and slow?

    預備,開始。(打拍子)

  • Ready and go ... um. (Clicks metronome)

    (打拍子)

  • (Clicks metronome)

    雙人舞開始了。(打拍子)

  • The duet starts. (Clicks metronome)

    (打拍子)

  • (Clicks metronome)

    好的,很好,好,很好,非常好。(掌聲)

  • So yeah, okay, good. Okay, nice, very nice. (Applause)

    很好。所以──(掌聲)

  • So good. So -- (Applause)

    好的。那是──(掌聲)

  • Okay. So that was -- (Applause)

    做的好。(掌聲)

  • Well done. (Applause)

    這是第二種運作方式。

  • That was the second way of working.

    第一種,身體對身體的轉移,對吧?

  • The first one, body-to-body transfer, yeah,

    和一個外在的心理結構合作,

  • with an outside mental architecture that I work with

    而他們為我承接記憶。

  • that they hold memory with for me.

    第二種,將他們視為物體來思考

  • The second one, which is using them as objects to think

    和結構物體,我下了一連串指令,

  • with their architectural objects, I do a series of

    「如果這樣,然後那樣」

  • provocations, I say, "If this happens, then that.

    若這樣,若那樣── 「我有許多像這樣的方式,

  • If this, if that happens -- " I've got lots of methods like that,

    但是非常、 非常快速」, 這是第三種方法。

  • but it's very, very quick, and this is a third method.

    他們已經開始了, 這是以任務為主的方法,

  • They're starting it already, and this is a task-based method,

    他們有自主權,

  • where they have the autonomy to make

    可以做所有的決定。

  • all of the decisions for themselves.

    我請大家試試看,

  • So I'd like us just to do, we're going to do a little

    在這短短一分鐘來點心靈舞蹈。

  • mental dance, a little, in this little one minute,

    請大家開始想像,

  • so what I'd love you to do is imagine,

    你可閉上雙眼或者睜開,

  • you can do this with your eyes closed, or open, and if you

    如果你不想,大可觀賞,由你決定。

  • don't want to do it you can watch them, it's up to you.

    花一秒鐘想一下"TED"在你面前,

  • Just for a second, think about that word "TED" in front of

    它就在你腦中,就在你腦海前,

  • you, so it